Mr. Faraj, I think you already have this, but attached is a
transcript of D. Robert Smego’s testimony in the Shemami case.
Also, Mr. Smego has a contract with the U.S. Attorney’s Office for providing
consultation on this case. The contract provides for Mr. Smego to receive
$150 per hour for consulting services, up to a total of $6,000. Mr. Smego also testified before Congress about former Iraqi
government documents. His testimony is attached and is also available on
the internet at: Michael C. Martin Assistant United States Attorney Eastern District of Michigan 211 West Fort Street, Room 2268 Detroit, MI 48226 (313) 226-9670 From: Haytham Faraj
[mailto:haytham@puckettfaraj.com] Mr. Martin: I have changed my address. I updated it in the ECF but you
may want to make a note of it for your records. Puckett & Faraj PC 6200 Schaeffer Road Suite 202 Dearborn MI 48124 (313)457-1390 Office My cell phone number remains the same and it is the best means
to get a hold of me. Have a happy Memorial Day From: Martin, Michael C.
(USAMIE) [mailto:Michael.C.Martin@usdoj.gov] Mr. Faraj, attached is a
cover letter and discovery
regarding a witness who’s testimony I intend to proffer during the
hearing next week. Also, I would like an opportunity after the hearing to
meet with you and Mr. Hamama. I don’t intend to ask him any questions
at the meeting, I simply want a chance to talk to him about the
government’s plea offer and how we might be able to resolve the
case. Perhaps we could do it immediately
after the hearing or,
if he is staying the night, sometime on Wednesday. <<Letter
to Counsel May 28 2010.pdf>> <<Order
from NDIL.pdf>> <<Al-Dani Giglio Disclosure.pdf>>
<<Latchin transcript 04 03 07a.1.pdf>> <<Latchin transcript
04 04 07a.1.pdf>> <<Latchin transcript 04 05 07a.1.a.pdf>>
<<Latchin transcript 9 15 2006 am.pdf>> <<Latchin transcript
9.15.2006 pm.pdf>> <<Latchin transcript 9.22.2006 am a.pdf>> Michael
C. Martin Assistant
United States Attorney Eastern
District of Michigan 211 West
Fort Street, Room 2268 Detroit,
MI 48226 (313)
226-9670 |
Attachment:
United States v Shemami (Smego Transcript).pdf
Description: United States v Shemami (Smego Transcript).pdf
[House Hearing, 109 Congress] [From the U.S. Government Printing Office] THE UNITED NATIONS OIL-FOR-FOOD PROGRAM: SADDAM HUSSEIN'S USE OF OIL ALLOCATIONS TO UNDERMINE SANCTIONS AND THE UNITED NATIONS SECURITY COUNCIL ======================================================================= HEARING before the SUBCOMMITTEE ON OVERSIGHT AND INVESTIGATIONS of the COMMITTEE ON ENERGY AND COMMERCE HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES ONE HUNDRED NINTH CONGRESS FIRST SESSION ---------- MAY 16, 2005 ---------- Serial No. 109-29 ---------- Printed for the use of the Committee on Energy and Commerce Available via the World Wide Web: http://www.access.gpo.gov/congress/ house THE UNITED NATIONS OIL-FOR-FOOD PROGRAM: SADDAM HUSSEIN'S USE OF OIL ALLOCATIONS TO UNDERMINE SANCTIONS AND THE UNITED NATIONS SECURITY COUNCIL U.S. GOVERNMENT PRINTING OFFICE 21-637 WASHINGTON : 2005 _____________________________________________________________________________ For Sale by the Superintendent of Documents, U.S. Government Printing Office Internet: bookstore.gpo.gov Phone: toll free (866) 512-1800; (202) 512�091800 Fax: (202) 512�092250 Mail: Stop SSOP, Washington, DC 20402�090001 THE UNITED NATIONS OIL-FOR-FOOD PROGRAM: SADDAM HUSSEIN'S USE OF OIL ALLOCATIONS TO UNDERMINE SANCTIONS AND THE UNITED NATIONS SECURITY COUNCIL ======================================================================= HEARING before the SUBCOMMITTEE ON OVERSIGHT AND INVESTIGATIONS of the COMMITTEE ON ENERGY AND COMMERCE HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES ONE HUNDRED NINTH CONGRESS FIRST SESSION __________ MAY 16, 2005 __________ Serial No. 109-29 __________ Printed for the use of the Committee on Energy and Commerce Available via the World Wide Web: http://www.access.gpo.gov/congress/ house COMMITTEE ON ENERGY AND COMMERCE JOE BARTON, Texas, Chairman RALPH M. HALL, Texas JOHN D. DINGELL, Michigan MICHAEL BILIRAKIS, Florida Ranking Member Vice Chairman HENRY A. WAXMAN, California FRED UPTON, Michigan EDWARD J. MARKEY, Massachusetts CLIFF STEARNS, Florida RICK BOUCHER, Virginia PAUL E. GILLMOR, Ohio EDOLPHUS TOWNS, New York NATHAN DEAL, Georgia FRANK PALLONE, Jr., New Jersey ED WHITFIELD, Kentucky SHERROD BROWN, Ohio CHARLIE NORWOOD, Georgia BART GORDON, Tennessee BARBARA CUBIN, Wyoming BOBBY L. RUSH, Illinois JOHN SHIMKUS, Illinois ANNA G. ESHOO, California HEATHER WILSON, New Mexico BART STUPAK, Michigan JOHN B. SHADEGG, Arizona ELIOT L. ENGEL, New York CHARLES W. ``CHIP'' PICKERING, ALBERT R. WYNN, Maryland Mississippi, Vice Chairman GENE GREEN, Texas VITO FOSSELLA, New York TED STRICKLAND, Ohio ROY BLUNT, Missouri DIANA DeGETTE, Colorado STEVE BUYER, Indiana LOIS CAPPS, California GEORGE RADANOVICH, California MIKE DOYLE, Pennsylvania CHARLES F. BASS, New Hampshire TOM ALLEN, Maine JOSEPH R. PITTS, Pennsylvania JIM DAVIS, Florida MARY BONO, California JAN SCHAKOWSKY, Illinois GREG WALDEN, Oregon HILDA L. SOLIS, California LEE TERRY, Nebraska CHARLES A. GONZALEZ, Texas MIKE FERGUSON, New Jersey JAY INSLEE, Washington MIKE ROGERS, Michigan TAMMY BALDWIN, Wisconsin C.L. ``BUTCH'' OTTER, Idaho MIKE ROSS, Arkansas SUE MYRICK, North Carolina JOHN SULLIVAN, Oklahoma TIM MURPHY, Pennsylvania MICHAEL C. BURGESS, Texas MARSHA BLACKBURN, Tennessee Bud Albright, Staff Director David Cavicke, Deputy Staff Director and General Counsel Reid P.F. Stuntz, Minority Staff Director and Chief Counsel ______ Subcommittee on Oversight and Investigations ED WHITFIELD, Kentucky, Chairman CLIFF STEARNS, Florida BART STUPAK, Michigan CHARLES W. ``CHIP'' PICKERING, Ranking Member Mississippi DIANA DeGETTE, Colorado CHARLES F. BASS, New Hampshire JAN SCHAKOWSKY, Illinois GREG WALDEN, Oregon JAY INSLEE, Washington MIKE FERGUSON, New Jersey TAMMY BALDWIN, Wisconsin MICHAEL C. BURGESS, Texas HENRY A. WAXMAN, California MARSHA BLACKBURN, Tennessee JOHN D. DINGELL, Michigan, JOE BARTON, Texas, (Ex Officio) (Ex Officio) (ii) C O N T E N T S __________ Page Testimony of: Anderson, Gerald C., Director, Office of Peacekeeping, Sanctions and Counterterrorism, U.S. Department of State... 62 Fawcett, John, Author, Report for Sources of Revenue for Saddam and Sons............................................ 11 Gordon, Joy, Professor of Philosophy, Fairfield University... 17 Smego, D. Robert, Arabic Linguist, one of the authors of the Duelfer Report............................................. 16 Additional material submitted for the record: Fawcett, John, Author, Report for Sources of Revenue for Saddam and Sons, response for the record................... 84 (iii) THE UNITED NATIONS OIL-FOR-FOOD PROGRAM: SADDAM HUSSEIN'S USE OF OIL ALLOCATIONS TO UNDERMINE SANCTIONS AND THE UNITED NATIONS SECURITY COUNCIL ---------- MONDAY, MAY 16, 2005 House of Representatives, Committee on Energy and Commerce, Subcommittee on Oversight and Investigations, Washington, DC. The subcommittee met, pursuant to notice, at 2:04 p.m., in room 2123, Rayburn House Office Building, Hon. Ed Whitfield (chairman) presiding. Members present: Representatives Whitfield, Stearns, Burgess, Blackburn, Barton (ex officio), Stupak, Inslee, and Waxman. Also present: Representative Norwood. Staff present: Mark Paoletta, chief counsel; Andrew Snowdon, majority counsel; Tom Feddo, majority counsel; Chad Grant, clerk; Edith Holleman, minority counsel; Voncille Hines, research assistant; and Alec Gerlach, minority staff assistant. Mr. Whitfield. At this time the committee will come to order. Today's hearing for the Subcommittee on Oversight and Investigation of the Energy and Commerce Committee is the United Nations' Oil for Food program, Saddam Hussein's use of oil allocations to undermine sanctions, and the United Nations Security Council. At this time I would like to ask unanimous consent to move documents contained in the binder into the record. And, without objection, so ordered. I will begin the hearing with an opening statement, and then we will proceed with opening statements. The United Nations Oil-for-Food program was initiated to ease the suffering of the Iraqi people. As we have learned in recent months from various reports, this program became a mechanism for the former Iraqi regime of Saddam Hussein to siphon off billions of dollars in illicit revenues, money that rightfully should have gone to the citizens of Iraq. Saddam's regime used oil contracts to influence foreign officials and well-connected individuals in an effort to undermine international economic sanctions, thereby keeping him in power. These allegations are not new, but the picture of how this could have happened under the oversight of the United Nations Security Council has been murky. Today the subcommittee will hear testimony and examine a variety of documents, many of which have been recently translated for the committee, to better understand the abuses of the Oil-for-Food program. The hearing will allow members to see how Hussein used oil allocations to undermine U.N. sanctions and manipulate political divisions within the Security Council and better understand the weaknesses in the U.N. Oversight of the program. The hearing will also serve the committee's longstanding interest in the workings of the United Nations. We will learn more today about the inner workings of the U.N.'s operation, and how France, Russia, and China in the 661 Committee supported the Hussein regime to the detriment of the Iraqi people. Saddam Hussein and his supporters found ways to exploit loopholes in the Oil-for-Food program to enrich themselves and to strengthen Iraq's military capabilities. Surcharges and kickbacks, both on oil and humanitarian goods contracts soon became the norm under the program. For instance, the committee has uncovered a handwritten form agreement signed by Iraq's former oil minister which shows that, beginning sometime after June 2000, each oil purchaser in the program had to agree to pay kickbacks to the regime, either in cash or by wire, into an Iraqi bank account outside of the program. Equally troubling are the allegations that Saddam Hussein may have been able to use the Oil-for-Food program to exploit divisions within the U.S. Security Council. We will hear today from Dr. Robert Smego, an outside consultant retained by the committee to review and translate numerous documents, including documents from the Iraqi Intelligence Service and State Oil Marketing Organization. Mr. Smego will present a series of documents that suggests a calculated strategy on the part of the regime to target influential businessmen, companies, and government officials who could advance Iraq's interests. When the names of many prominent political figures, most notably those of Russia and France, appeared in the Duelfer Report last fall, there were cries of outrage and denial. However, the documents presented here today appear to confirm that some of these individuals were indeed using the Oil-for- Food program for their own purposes. I can think of no legitimate reason for any politician or government official of any nation to receive oil from Saddam Hussein. Ironically, every dollar that these people took out of the program was money that should have gone to help the Iraqi people. Could these abuses have been prevented? Perhaps not entirely, but there's little doubt that lax oversight on the part of the U.N. Secretariat and internal divisions within the so-called 661 Committee permitted them to continue. Let me note here that I can only imagine the political and logistical difficulties involved in running such a massive program. However, these difficulties do not justify the failures in oversight responsibilities. We will also hear today from John Fawcett who, for the past decade, has been tracking the financial assets of major human rights abusers, such as Slobodan Milosevic, Saddam Hussein, and the al Qaeda network. Finally, we will hear from Mr. Gerald Anderson of the U.S. State Department who will provide some insights into the inner workings of the 661 Sanctions Committee, the committee within the U.N. That ran the Oil-for-Food program. Let me welcome all the witnesses, and thank them for what promises to be a most informative hearing. [The prepared statement of Hon. Ed Whitfield follows:] Prepared Statement of Hon. Ed Whitfield, Chairman, Subcommittee on Oversight and Investigations The United Nations (U.N.) Oil-for-Food Program (Program) was set up to ease the suffering of the Iraqi people. But unfortunately, it also may have prolonged their suffering. As we've learned in recent months from various reports, this Program became a mechanism for the former Iraqi regime of Saddam Hussein to siphon off billions of dollars in illicit revenues--money that rightfully should have gone to the citizens of Iraq. Saddam's Regime also used oil contracts to influence foreign officials and well-connected individuals in an effort to undermine international economic sanctions, thereby keeping him in power. None of these allegations are new, but the picture of how this could have happened under the oversight of the United Nations Security Council has been murky. Today, the Subcommittee will take testimony and examine a variety of documents--many of which have been recently translated for the Committee--to gain a clearer view into the abuses of the Oil for Food Program. The hearing will allow members to examine how Hussein used oil allocations to undermine U.N. sanctions and manipulate political divisions within the Security Council and apparent weaknesses in U.N. oversight of the Program. The hearing will also serve the Committee's long-standing interest in the workings of the United Nations--particularly at the intersection of national security and world energy markets and trade. We will learn more today about the inner workings of the U.N.'s operations, and how actions there might have prevented such abuses. There is no doubt at this point that Saddam Hussein and his cronies found ways to exploit loopholes in the Oil-for-Food Program to enrich themselves and to strengthen the Iraq's military capabilities. Surcharges and kickbacks, both on oil and humanitarian goods contracts, soon became the norm under the Program. For instance, the Committee has uncovered a handwritten form agreement, signed by Iraq's former Oil Minister, which shows that, beginning sometime after June 2000, each oil purchaser in the Program had to agree to pay kickbacks to the Regime, either in cash or by wire into an Iraqi bank account outside of the Program. Equally troubling are the allegations that Saddam Hussein may have been able to use the Oil-for-Food Program to exploit divisions within the U.N. Security Council. We will hear today from D. Robert Smego, an outside consultant retained by the Committee to review and translate numerous documents gathered from various Iraqi sources, including documents from the Iraqi Intelligence Service and State Oil Marketing Organization, or SOMO. Mr. Smego will present a series of documents that suggest a calculated strategy on the part of the Regime to target influential businessmen, companies, and government officials who could advance Iraq's interests--particularly within the Security Council. When the names of many prominent political figures, most notably those of France and Russia, appeared in the Duelfer Report last Fall, there were cries of outrage and denial. However, the documents presented here today appear to confirm that some of these individuals were indeed using the Oil-for-Food Program for their own purposes. I can think of no legitimate reason for any politician or government official--of any nation--to get oil from Saddam Hussein. Ironically, every dollar that these people took out of the Program was money that should have gone to help the Iraqi people--the very people that they claimed to be helping. Could these abuses have been prevented? Perhaps not entirely, but there is little doubt that lax oversight on the part of the U.N. Secretariat, and internal divisions within the so-called 661 Committee, permitted them to continue. Let me note here that I can only imagine the political and logistical difficulties involved in running such a massive Program. However, these difficulties do not justify the failures in oversight responsibilities. We will hear today from John Fawcett, who, for the past decade, has been tracking the financial assets of major human rights abusers, such as Slobodan Milosevic, Saddam Hussein, and the al Qaeda network. Mr. Fawcett will provide some perspective how these problems could have been avoided, including (1) vetting all contracts for price and quality, and (2) performing due diligence on the parties that Saddam was contracting with, and (3) increasing transparency in the hiring of inspectors. Finally, we will hear from Mr. Gerald Anderson of the U.S. State Department, who will provide some insights into the inner workings of the 661 Sanctions Committee, the Committee within the U.N. that ran the Oil-for-Food Program. Let me welcome all of the witnesses and thank them for what promises to be a most informative hearing. Much of the dispute today involves a lack of transparency in the oversight deployed by the United Nations. If we are going to restore some trust in that institution as it delves into other matters affecting our international energy markets, public health, and welfare, the United States--and indeed the entire international community-- deserves a clearer picture of precisely how those important matters are being handled. Today's hearing should help us understand how some trust might be restored. Mr. Whitfield. At this time I will call on the ranking minority member, Mr. Stupak, for his opening statement. Mr. Stupak. Well, thank you, Mr. Chairman. This is an unusual hearing for an investigative subcommittee. In fact, it seems to me that this is a hearing in search of an investigation. If you take a look at this morning's Washington Post, the lead article gave an astounding level of detail from documents collected by the Senate Committee on Saddam Hussein's use of oil allocations to influence Russian politicians. This story is not new. In September 2002, The New York Times stated, ``Baghdad owes Moscow $8 billion in debt incurred before the Gulf War, and has used trade under the Oil-for-Food program to curry Moscow's favor.'' Last year, the Duelfer Report gave the names of Russian politicians who received oil allocations. But the level of detail about these deals obtained after months of investigation is new, and that is what was intriguing about this Washington Post story. It involves weeks of overseas travel, interviews with former Iraqi officials, and international businessmen, and a review of U.S. Government investigative documents. Frankly, Mr. Chairman, this committee has done--has not done anywhere near that level of work and has very little to add. There are four other congressional committees focused on the United Nations and the Oil-for-Food program. They are all far ahead of this committee in their level of investigation and knowledge. But there are areas that this committee can investigate and no one else seems to want to look at. No one seems to want to talk about the United Nations' sanctions and oil trading regime which was approved by the Security Council of which the United States is a member, or the role of the Sanctions Committee, another committee the U.S. was part of that oversaw the program and what it knew about the manner in which the oil allocations were used by Iraq. No one seems to want to know about the relationship of U.S. oil companies to the shady middlemen and the oil traders who actually lifted oil from Iraq. This is not a simple criminal or ethical matter as it is often portrayed. It was a system built by geopolitical realities that everyone was aware of and either condoned or chose to ignore at the time. Seventy-five percent of Iraqi oil, regardless of who initially purchased it and whether or not they paid illegal surcharges, ended up in the United States at U.S. refineries. How did it get there? What did the U.S. companies know about the illegal surcharges and when did they know it? Some small U.S. oil dealers have been indicted. But despite this requests from this side of the minority to subpoena documents from those companies, it has not been done. Some bigger U.S. Oil companies are also being investigated, but once again, this committee hasn't even talked to them despite staff requests from the minority. No one seems to want to talk about the massive smuggling of oil through Jordan, Turkey, Syria, and Egypt that was going on. Both the Volcker and the Duelfer reports found that the largest sum of the illegal revenue obtained by Saddam Hussein came through these well-known illegal oil purchases. These oil purchases were openly discussed in the press at the time. The Sanctions Committee--again, the U.S. was a member of that committee-- discussed it frequently but refused to stop it. The International Relations Committee of both the House and the Senate received notice every year stating that it was in the national interest of the United States to continue foreign aid to Jordan and Turkey, even though they were in violation of the U.N. Sanctions. Why hasn't the committee looked at the United States' role in this massive violation of U.N. Sanctions? It seems that many in Congress are comfortable with just calling this foreign aid and bashing the U.N. But are not interested in holding those in the U.S. who may have violated these sanctions accountable. Press reports in January of this year indicated that the office of foreign assets in the United States Treasury actually promised that they would not prosecute a U.S. company for breaking the sanctions in early 2003 to provide oil to a Jordanian company. Minority staff drafted letters to the U.S. Company in February requesting documents and interviews, but again, we couldn't get a signature or approval from the majority. I would ask, Mr. Chairman, instead of joining in the chorus of the committees howling at the United Nations to obtain diplomatically protected documents, that we head in a different direction. This subcommittee should investigate the U.S. oil companies who allegedly and knowingly worked around the U.N. Sanctions to supply oil to certain countries with the apparent knowledge and consent of the U.S. Government. Mr. Chairman, we have a choice. We can waste taxpayer dollars by duplicating the work of other committees in Congress that they have already done by investigating foreign sources, or we can be leaders and investigate and expose the domestic abuses of the Oil-for-Food program here at home. It is my hope that, under your leadership, we will do the latter. With that, Mr. Chairman, I would yield back the balance of my time. Mr. Whitfield. At this time, the Chair will recognize the chairman of the full committee, the full energy and commerce committee, Mr. Barton of Texas. Chairman Barton. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I want to commend you for holding this hearing. I think we need to put in the record that this is the first subcommittee to hold a hearing on the U.N. Oil-for-Food scandal, and we did it when I was subcommittee chairman back in the Clinton Administration. We were also the first subcommittee to hold a hearing in this go- around, and we have been at the full committee level investigating this for the last several years and will continue to do so. In the last year, we have learned much about the program's mismanagement and its manipulation. We know today, for example, that Saddam Hussein's officials deliberately underpriced Iraq oil so that the middleman and oil traders could kick back profits into Saddam's personal bank accounts. We also know the regime would overpay merchants for humanitarian goods so that the excess money could be diverted to those bank accounts. This is something that we learned on a trip that I personally led to Iraq last fall and met with some of the Iraqi officials in person that were responsible for those particular bank accounts. We now know that the U.N. Oil overseers identified these activities, brought them to the attention of the program's leadership, and even proposed mechanisms to prevent the illicit activity. Yet nothing was done. Finally, we know that the regime perverted the program to influence politicians around the world and leaders inside the United Nations by giving them personally valuable oil vouchers. Today's hearing will examine new documents that illuminate influence peddling. Undoubtedly, Saddam's regime hoped that these bribes would erode and eliminate the sanctions. I would not be surprised if we eventually uncover evidence of quid pro quos directly related to these vouchers. It seems clear that under Saddam, Oil-for-Food became oil for influence. This mismanagement mess, if you will, is a stain on the United Nations and its current leaders. If the U.N. Leadership had its way, this mess would have been swept under the rug. But the U.N. Is not going to have its way today. The U.S. Government funds most of the U.N.'s operating budget. We are the largest contributor to the U.N. Operating budget. And at this moment, our soldiers are risking and giving their lives to defend the fledgling democracy in Iraq. We must not forget that, if the U.N. Had had its way, Saddam Hussein would still be in power, Saddam Hussein would still be dispensing bribes, Saddam Hussein would still be controlling his Army, Saddam Hussein would still be threatening his people, and Saddam Hussein would still be threatening to invade his neighbors in the Middle East. But before Iraq was liberated, the only program that was meant to bring relief to the Iraqi people instead brought Saddam Hussein the key to unlocking the greatest threat to his power, economic sanctions. We will hear today how the Oil-for-Food program allowed Saddam Hussein to enrich his regime, bribe world leaders, and begin to build an infrastructure that could 1 day be used to reconstruct an arsenal for intimidation and aggression. In the meantime, the suffering of the average Iraqi family continued. The U.N. 661 Committee watched this scam unfold but was paralyzed by bureaucratic infighting. In the end, the Oil- for-Food program was a profound and dangerous failure. I look forward to hearing from our witnesses today. I wish to thank them for their attendance. This committee--and I want to reiterate. This committee, the Energy and Commerce Committee, is not opposed to anything that the other committees of the House and Senate are doing. I think collectively all the efforts of this committee and the other committees in both bodies will get to the bottom of this scandal, but this committee is going to be a part of that and in many ways is going to lead that effort. I also want to begin to investigate the possibility of recovering as much of the billions and billions of dollars that was looted from the Oil-for-Food program and use that money to reinvest in the Iraq of today to try to help the Iraqi people today as they fight for their freedoms. Thank you again, Mr. Chairman, for your leadership on this issue. I look forward to working with you and others of this subcommittee to continue this investigation. [The prepared statement of Hon. Joe Barton follows:] Prepared Statement of Hon. Joe Barton, Chairman, Committee on Energy and Commerce Thank you Chairman Whitfield. This afternoon we continue this Committee's examination of the United Nations Oil-for-Food Program. Since last year, we have learned much about both the program's mismanagement and manipulation. We know, for example, that Saddam Hussein's officials deliberately under-priced Iraqi oil so that middlemen and oil traders could kick back profits into Saddam's bank accounts. Also, the regime would overpay merchants for humanitarian goods so that the excess money could be diverted to those bank accounts, outside UN scrutiny. We now know that UN ``oil overseers'' identified these activities, brought them to the attention of the program's leadership, and even proposed mechanisms to prevent this illicit activity. And yet nothing was done. Finally, the regime perverted the program to influence politicians around the world and leaders inside the United Nations by giving them valuable oil vouchers. Today's hearing will examine new documents that illuminate influence peddling. Undoubtedly, Saddam's regime hoped these bribes would erode and eliminate the sanctions. I would not be surprised if we eventually uncover evidence of quid pro quos directly related to these vouchers. It seems clear that under Saddam, oil-for- food became oil-for-influence. This mismanagement--this mess--is a stain on the United Nations and on its leaders. If the UN leadership had its way, this mess would have been swept under the rug, but the UN is not going to have its way today. Americans fund most of the UN's operating budget, and at this moment, America's warriors are risking and giving their lives to defend the fledgling democracy in Iraq. We must not forget that if the UN had its way, Saddam would still be dispensing bribes, building his army, threatening his people, and invading his neighbors. But before Iraq was liberated, the only program that was meant to bring relief to the Iraqi people instead brought Saddam Hussein the key to unlocking the gravest threat to his power--economic sanctions. We will hear today how the Oil-for-Food Program allowed Saddam Hussein to enrich his regime, bribe world leaders, and begin to build an infrastructure that could one day be used to reconstruct an arsenal for intimidation and aggression. In the meantime, the suffering of the average Iraqi family continued. The UN's 661 Committee watched the scam unfold, but was paralyzed by bureaucratic infighting. In the end, the Oil for Food Program was a profound and dangerous failure. I look forward to hearing from our witnesses today, and thank them for their attendance. We intend to get to the bottom of this scandal. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I yield back the remainder of my time. Mr. Whitfield. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. At this time, I will recognize Mr. Waxman of California. Mr. Waxman. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. And I appreciate you calling the hearing today. I support the committee's investigation and believe Congress should determine the full extent of Saddam Hussein's efforts to divert humanitarian Oil-for-Food funds that were intended for the benefit of the Iraqi people. Although I support the committee's goal, I do have a concern with its approach. Today's hearing is the 13th congressional hearing about the Oil-for-Food program. Tomorrow's hearing by Senator Coleman will be the 14th. My concern is that while Congress is actively investigating the Oil-for-Food program, we are ignoring our Nation's own actions on the development fund for Iraq, the successor to the Oil-for- Food program run by the Bush administration. The administration has failed to properly manage and account for billions of dollars in the Iraqi funds, and the committee is doing nothing to investigate this. I would like to have in the record two charts. The first one shows the finding of our own auditors and investigators looking into the DFI. First, in January, the special inspector general for Iraqi reconstruction, a U.S. Government official, concluded that the Bush administration failed to properly account for $8.8 billion of Iraqi oil proceeds in the DFI. The inspector general concluded that the administration did not implement adequate managerial controls, did not implement adequate financial controls, and did not adequately control DFI contracting actions. Second. Just 2 weeks ago the inspector general found that the administration failed to account for $96.6 million in cash from the Iraqi funds that were supposed to go to local reconstruction projects. The IG found that, instead of helping the Iraqi people, U.S. officials tried to launder these funds. The IG referred these officials for criminal prosecution. And, third. The defense contract audit agency, the Pentagon's own auditors, concluded that Halliburton has overcharged by at least $212 million under its oil contract in Iraq. The Bush administration awarded Halliburton's no bid monopoly oil contract in secret, and then funded it with Iraqi oil proceeds from the DFI. My other chart shows findings by U.S. Government officials and other independent auditors who conclude that the administration has not complied with U.N. Security Council Resolution 1483, which requires the administration to use Iraqi funds in a transparent manner for the benefit of the Iraqi people. On January 30, 2005, the special inspector general for Iraq reconstruction concluded that the administration violated Resolution 1483 requirement to use DFI funds in a transparent manner. On April 29, 2005, the international advisory and monitoring board, which is charged with monitoring the administration's compliance under the resolution, concluded that, ``use of DFI resources that is not for the benefit of the Iraqi people is in conflict with U.N. Security Council Resolution 1483.'' and members can also review a series of official Pentagon audits that the administration submitted to the United Nations after blacking out more than 460 references to overcharges to the DFI. Mr. Chairman, Congress should investigate allegations about the Oil-for-Food program, but we should also investigate our own administration's failure to properly account for Iraqi funds. Our commitment in both cases is the same: To ensure that the Iraqi people who have been oppressed for decades receive the full benefit of their own Nation's funds. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Whitfield. Mr. Waxman, were you asking unanimous consent that those documents be entered into the record? Mr. Waxman. Yes, I would like to ask unanimous consent. Mr. Whitfield. I asked a minute ago to enter some documents into the record that were made available to your side last Wednesday, about 6, 7 days ago. I have not had an opportunity to see that. Could I see this document that you are referring to? Mr. Waxman. Sure. If you prefer, Mr. Chairman, why don't I withhold that unanimous request consent until later in the hearing so you would be able to see it. Mr. Whitfield. And I would also like to ask, was this a study conducted by the Federal Government? Who conducted this study? Mr. Waxman. We are talking about six reports that are all cited in my statement. Mr. Whitfield. And who conducted those studies? Mr. Waxman. Let me go through. The special inspector general for Iraq reconstruction is one. The International Advisory and Monitoring Board, two. The Defense Contract Audit Agency, which is the Pentagon's own auditors. And there are multiple reports by each of them. Mr. Whitfield. If you would give me a copy of that. And I would just like to reserve a point of order. But, in the meantime, I am going to go on and call on---- Chairman Barton. Mr. Chairman, could you yield to me on that point? Mr. Whitfield. Yes. Chairman Barton. This subcommittee always works in a bipartisan fashion. And if the gentleman from California shared the documents so that we know before the fact what is in them, we are almost always willing to put them into the record. My understanding is they have not been shared with the staff. And I am sure he is willing to share those so we can look at them. Mr. Waxman. Well, let me point out, these are not hidden documents. They were furnished to all the committees by the Inspector General. But I would be happy to have you look at them. I wasn't trying to withhold any documents from you. These are documents that have been submitted to the Congress, and they have been out in the public domain. And so we would like to have them as part of the record after you feel comfortable enough to admit them into the record. Mr. Whitfield. Well, I think that this would probably be fine. But what I think we ought to do is just submit the entire report, reports in their entirety. Mr. Waxman. I have no problem with that. There are multiple reports. I think there are six separate reports. If you want to have all of them in their entirety, then that is certainly fine. Mr. Whitfield. I would prefer that we just submit the entire report rather than just excerpts from the reports. So, if there is no objection to having the entire reports placed into the record, that would be fine. [The material referred to is retained in subcommittee files.] Mr. Waxman. Okay. Mr. Whitfield. At this point I would call on Mr. Norwood of Georgia for his opening statement. I am sorry. Mr. Burgess, you are on the subcommittee. Go ahead. Mr. Burgess. Mr. Chairman, I have an opening statement I will just submit for the record in the interest of time so we can get on to examining the witnesses. Mr. Whitfield. Thank you. Ms. Blackburn, do you have an opening statement? Mr. Norwood? Mr. Norwood. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. I must admit that this stuff that has just been handed out, it looks to me like they are headlines out of The New York Times rather than any report that anybody has produced. But I think it equally important we find out exactly who produced it and consider the source. I thank you today for allowing me to join you. I sincerely appreciate the courtesy. I have been very concerned about this issue of corruption at the United Nations, and that as I understand is what this hearing is about. Though there are those who would divert it to another subject, I think today is about the corruption at the U.N., and with the Oil-for-Food program in Iraq. I wanted to be here simply to learn more. I would like to start by commending you for continuing to focus some attention on the corruption at the U.N. Oil-for-Food program. There is plenty to discuss and scrutinize as we have seen, and there is plenty being discussed back home in all of our districts. I think the American people want to have an understanding of this. It is no secret that during my tenure in Congress, I have not particularly been a fan of the U.N. I think there are some pretty good reasons for that. And this committee needs no reminder that for a decade the U.N. allowed Saddam Hussein to blatantly defy 18 U.N. Resolutions. The United States spends millions, if not billions, of dollars a year on U.N. programs and policies that are often totally contrary to the principles of freedom that most Americans hold dear. That is why people back home where I am from want to know what is going on. It is truly unfortunate that we do not have the opportunity today to question a representative of the U.N. Perhaps that opportunity will present itself in the future, Mr. Chairman. Regardless, the U.N. is not the topic of the hearing today; the U.N. Oil-for-Food program is. As we all know, the Oil-for-Food program was established in 1995, April, to strike a balance between enforcing compliance of all relevant U.N. Security Council resolutions, and alleviating hunger, suffering, human suffering in Iraq. Unfortunately, what we all now know is that the program was riddled with corruption in many ways. What should have been a humanitarian program ended up funding Saddam Hussein's dictatorship and possibly terrorist groups. The GAO estimates that from 1997 through 2002, the former Iraqi regime acquired $10.1 billion in illegal revenues. This includes $5.7 billion from oil smuggling and $4.4 billion from illicit surcharges on oil sales and after-sale charges on suppliers. Numerous United Nations, independent, and Iraqi investigations have been directed into these illicitly diverted funds. As has been pointed out earlier, major doubts exist about the U.N.'s ability to investigate this level of fraud, and I am highly suspicious of their resistance to the facts. After all, it was under their watch that their own program was abused. I look forward to the hearing. I look forward to hearing the testimony of the witnesses today. And, again, I thank you for the opportunity to join you. Mr. Whitfield. Thank you. Is there anyone else wishing to give an opening statement at this time? If not, then we will call panel one, the witness Mr. John Fawcett, Mr. Robert Smego, and Dr. Joy Gordon. I want to thank the three of you for being with us this morning. We look forward to your testimony. You are aware that the committee is holding an investigative hearing, and, when doing so, has had the practice of taking testimony under oath. Do any of you this morning or this afternoon have any objection to testifying under oath? Okay. The Chair then advises you that, under the rules of the House and the rules of the committee, you are also entitled to be advised by counsel. Do you desire to be advised by counsel during your testimony today? In that case, if you would please rise and raise your right hand, I will swear you in. [Witnesses sworn.] Mr. Whitfield. You are now under oath, and you may give your 5-minute summary of your written statement. And, Mr. Fawcett, we will begin with you. TESTIMONY OF JOHN FAWCETT, AUTHOR, REPORT FOR SOURCES OF REVENUE FOR SADDAM AND SONS; D. ROBERT SMEGO, ARABIC LINGUIST, ONE OF THE AUTHORS OF THE DUELFER REPORT; AND JOY GORDON, PROFESSOR OF PHILOSOPHY, FAIRFIELD UNIVERSITY Mr. Fawcett. Thank you for inviting me here before the committee in today's hearing. I have worked internationally---- Mr. Whitfield. Would you turn your microphone on, please. Mr. Fawcett. Okay. I have worked internationally for the past 25 years, I spent 10 years in oil exploration in the Middle East and Africa, after which I spent the next 10 years involved in humanitarian and human rights work largely in the Balkans and Iraq. Over the last 5 years I have been tracking the financial assets of major human rights abusers, including Slobodan Milosevic, Saddam Hussein, and al Qaeda. I began looking at the Oil-for-Food program in 1998 and was a co-author with Susan Blaustein of Sources of Revenue for Saddam & Sons. The paper was published in 2002 by the Coalition for International Justice, and they graciously agreed to sponsor my appearance today. The Oil-for-Food program cannot be viewed separately from the history of corruption under Saddam Hussein. Saddam Hussein began his financial rip-offs in the late 1960's with the establishment of his first shell companies in Milan and Lugano, and continued until he was toppled in 2003. My written statement goes into more detail on this topic. When the U.N. Began negotiating with Iraq in 1991 to establish the Oil-for-Food program, and the first negotiations were led by then Assistant Secretary General Kofi Annan, no one dealing with Iraq could credibly say they were not aware of the potential for corruption. U.N. Secretary General Perez de Cuellar knew. His successor Boutros Boutros Ghali knew. Kofi Annan knew. The members of the Security Council certainly knew. All the permanent members, with the exception of China, had been active participants in arms embargo busting with Saddam throughout the previous decade, that is, the 1980's. By the time the program began in late 1996, the U.N. Had ceded to Saddam the authority to choose his business partners from both the sale of Iraqi oil and the purchase of humanitarian supplies. This crucial decision laid the groundwork for the ensuing corruption. There were two major methods of illicit profiting: Oil vouchers were given to favored individuals or organizations that provided Iraq with political support. The vouchers were then sold to official U.N. Approved contractors. The illicit profit in this scheme amounted to up to $1 million per tanker load. Two Oil-for-Food contractors who were very adept at this were the shady Swiss Liechtenstein firms of Alcon and Fenar. These companies were created in the haven of corporate secrecy, Liechtenstein, for the sole purpose of doing illicit business with Saddam Hussein's Iraq. Aside from kickbacks, the political services they provided to Saddam are as yet unknown. To this point, the Swiss and Liechtenstein authorities have failed to publicize the beneficial owners of either company despite these firms having been identified as suspicious as early as January 2001. Between them, Alcon and Fenar did nearly $2.5 billion worth of business under the program, of which some $400 million was done in the last few months of Saddam's reign. One wonders whether this money is funding the car bombs that are tearing apart men, women, and children in Iraq on a daily basis. The other major scam in the Oil-for-Food program involved overcharging or invoice padding for goods sold to Iraq. One commodity in which this practice took place was baby formula. It normally sells for about $2,000 per ton, but a corrupt supplier under the Oil-for-Food program would charge the U.N. On behalf of Iraq 2,500. The difference was, again, split with Iraqi officials. While the U.N. Children's agency UNICEF and others mounted public campaigns decrying the suffering and deaths of Iraqi children due to sanctions, price gouging was taking place on the very product that could help these children. If there is anything that UNICEF knows how to do, it is to procure, transport, and distribute baby formula. They do so in war zones and disasters worldwide. While UNICEF continually published Iraq government statistics on child mortality related to sanctions, not once did they raise a voice about the baby formula rip-off. The inspection procedures for oil exports as well as for humanitarian imports were toothless from the beginning. The inspectors had no mandate to prevent smuggling of oil out of Iraq or smuggling of goods into Iraq. The inspectors have no mandate to check the quality of food or medicines entering Iraq, and usually failed to check even the quantity of goods being imported. At the Jordanian, Syrian, and Turkish border crossings, hundreds of trucks entered Iraq daily with sanctions-busting goods and left Iraq carrying sanctions- busting oil. The inspectors could do nothing more than tip their hat and wave their clip board, and literally that is what they did. Knowing the nature both in cruelty and corruption of the regime they were dealing with, why would international officials allow such a system to come into place? First, there is a certain anti-American predisposition that has built up over decades within the U.N. Second, there was a perception that it was a catastrophic humanitarian situation in Iraq, and that the population was on the verge of starvation. Third, international officials also stood to gain financially. Officials of over 100 countries either profited illicitly from the Oil-for-Food program, failed in their oversight duties to prevent corruption, or both. What made the graft under the Oil-for-Food program different from other international financial scandals was the use of the illicit gains by Saddam Hussein. He did not just fatten the Jordanian and Swiss bank accounts of his family and cronies, though there was plenty of that; the illicit funds were also used to create a political slush fund of global proportions. He bought presidents, prime ministers, legislators, Ambassadors, media, and NGO officials, and actively funded the anti sanctions campaign. Mr. Whitfield. Mr. Fawcett, you are about a minute and 30 seconds over. Mr. Fawcett. All right. Maybe in the questioning I could go in, then, to what I think the U.N. Could have done in the midst of all of these problems. Though I would like to say, the primary importance for the U.N. To act was that it had to be led by honest and courageous officials. And I will leave it at that. [The prepared statement of John Fawcett follows:] Prepared Statement of John Fawcett INTRODUCTION Thank you for inviting me to appear before the committee at today's hearing. I have worked internationally for the past 25 years. I spent ten years in oil exploration in the Middle East and Africa. The following ten years I was involved in humanitarian and human rights work largely in the Balkans and Iraq. Over the last five years I have been tracking the financial assets of major human rights abusers, including Slobodan Milosevic, Saddam Hussein, and al Qaeda. I have contracted to a variety of governmental, non-governmental, and for profit organizations. I began looking at the Oil for Food program in 1998, and was a co-author with Susan Blaustein of Sources of Revenue for Saddam and Sons. The paper was published in 2002 by the Coalition for International Justice and they have graciously agreed to sponsor my appearance today. HISTORY OF SADDAM'S CORRUPTION The Oil for Food program can not be viewed separately from the history of corruption under Saddam Hussein. Saddam began his financial rip-offs in the late 1960s with the establishment of his first shell companies in Milan and Lugano. In the mid 70s he instituted a 5% rake- off on all Iraqi oil exports, with the proceeds being sent to Swiss bank accounts via major US banks in New York City. Shortly after seizing the Iraqi presidency in 1979 he invaded Iran and an arms embargo was imposed. He actively violated the embargo with the assistance of many countries in what came to be known as Iraqgate. Within days of his invasion of Kuwait in August 1990, comprehensive international sanctions were imposed. Within hours an energetic campaign of sanctions busting began. After surviving the first Gulf War, he directed that the sanctions busting be greatly expanded. When the UN began negotiating with Iraq in 1991 to establish the oil for food program, (and the first negotiations were led by then Assistant Secretary General Kofi Annan) no one dealing with Iraq could credibly say they were not aware of the potential for corruption. UN Secretary General Perez de Cuellar knew. His successor Boutros Boutros Ghali knew. Kofi Annan knew. The members of the Security Council certainly knew. All the permanent members, with the exception of China, had been active participants in embargo busting with Saddam throughout the previous decade. The embargo busting involved both kickbacks to Saddam as well as invoice padding, two methods of illicit activity that were later widely used during the Oil for Food Program. TWO TYPES OF RIP-OFFS By the time the program began in late 1996, the UN had ceded to Saddam the authority to choose his business partners for both the sale of Iraqi oil and the purchase of humanitarian supplies. This crucial decision laid the groundwork for the ensuing corruption. There were two major methods of illicit profiting by the regime and a host of minor schemes. Oil vouchers were given to favored individuals or organizations that provided Iraq with political support. The vouchers were then sold to an official UN approved contractor. This contractor received the oil at a discount and then sold it on to other traders and eventually to major refiners. The illicit profit in this scheme amounted to up to $1 million per tanker load. Two oil for food contractors who were very adept at this were the shady Swiss-Liechtenstein firms Alcon and Fenar. These companies were created in the haven of corporate secrecy, Liechtenstein, for the sole purpose of doing illicit business with Saddam Hussein's Iraq. Alcon and Fenar were official UN contractors as well as voucher recipients. Aside from kickbacks the political services they provided to Saddam are as yet unknown. To this point the Swiss and Liechtenstein authorities have failed to publicize the beneficial owners of either company, despite these firms having been identified as suspicious as early as January 2001. The Liechtensteiners, who for a fee, put their names to the corporate registry documents were; for Alcon, Rainer Marxer and Martin Batliner; for Fenar, Patrick Hilty and Horst Buchel. Between them, Alcon and Fenar did nearly $2.5 billion worth of business under the program, of which some $400 million was done in the last few months of Saddam's reign. One wonders whether this money is funding the car bombs that are tearing apart men, women and children in Iraq on a daily basis. The other major scam in the oil for food program involved over charging or invoice padding for goods sold to Iraq. One commodity in which this practice took place was baby formula. It normally sold for about $2000 per ton, but a corrupt supplier would charge the UN on behalf of Iraq, $2500. The difference was again split with the Iraqi officials. While the UN and others mounted public campaigns decrying the suffering and deaths of Iraqi children, price gouging was taking place on the very product that could help these children. If there is anything that UNICEF knows how to do, it is to procure, transport and distribute baby formula. They do so in war zones and disasters worldwide. While UNICEF continually published Iraqi government statistics on child mortality related to sanctions, not once did they raise a voice about the baby formula rip-off. SHAM INSPECTIONS The inspection procedures for oil exports as well as for humanitarian imports were toothless from the beginning. The inspectors had no mandate to prevent smuggling of oil out of Iraq, or smuggling of goods into Iraq. The inspectors had no mandate to check the quality of food or medicines entering Iraq and usually failed to check even the quantity of goods being imported. At the Jordanian, Syrian and Turkish border crossings, hundreds of trucks entered Iraq daily with sanctions busting goods and left Iraq carrying sanctions busting oil. The inspectors could do nothing more than tip their hat and wave their clipboard. This was an exercise in futility and many inspectors sunk into frustration or inebriation. After studying and thinking about this program for several years, I have come to the conclusion that the inspections regime established by the UN was window dressing only. To be clear, I believe that UN officials set up the procurement as well as the inspection regime of the Oil for Food program in such a manner as to allow Saddam Hussein to personally profit from it. The Security Council was fully aware of the potential for corruption under the program at every step of the negotiations. WHY WAS IT ALLOWED TO HAPPEN? Knowing the nature, both in cruelty and corruption of the regime they were dealing with, why would these international officials allow such a system to come into place? First there is a certain anti- American predisposition that has built up over decades within the UN. This tends to look skeptically at US positions on issues and more sympathetically at US opponents. This is not an unhealthy posture by itself. Second, there was a perception that there was a catastrophic humanitarian situation in Iraq and that the population was on the verge of starvation. All of the data upon which the assessments of the humanitarian situation in Iraq were made was generated by the Iraqi government. It was also in the financial interest of the UN humanitarian agencies to increase the amounts of funds allocated to Iraq. These factors contributed towards fostering an international public perception of impending disaster. The third reason why international officials would agree to a system that profited Saddam Hussein is that they also stood to gain financially. Officials of over 100 countries, either profited illicitly from the Oil for Food program, failed in their oversight duties to prevent corruption, or both. What made the graft under the oil for food program different from other international financial scandals was the use of the illicit gains by Saddam Hussein. He did not just fatten the Jordanian and Swiss bank accounts of his family and cronies, though there was plenty of that. The illicit funds were also used to create a political slush fund of global proportions. He bought presidents, prime ministers, legislators, ambassadors, media and NGO officials, and actively funded the anti- sanctions campaign. COULD THE UN HAVE DONE ANYTHING? With an Iraqi regime very experienced in corruption, a weak Security Council, and officials and businessmen from dozens of countries eager to put their hands into Saddam's pockets, was it possible for the United Nations to do anything except acquiesce to corruption? The answer is yes. In the face of all these cards stacked against it, there was one essential ingredient to assist the Iraqi people as well as battle corruption. The UN had to be lead by honest and courageous officials. From 1996 to the end of the program in 2003, had the UN been led by honest and courageous officials, they would have done the following. Instead of awarding the first major monitoring and banking contracts via a secretive back-door process, senior UN officials would have insisted on adhering to their own competitive bidding regulations and opened the process to public scrutiny. Had they done so the weak monitoring effort would have been exposed before the program began and the allegations of conflict of interest by the Secretary General and his son would have been addressed. An aggressive effort would have been made to vet all contracts for price and quality. The Security Council had instructed the UN to do so, but they made token efforts at best. Even the few contracts which UN officials found to be overpriced were never acted upon by the Security Council. However, UN officials did not have to be satisfied with just passing the buck to the Security Council. There was nothing stopping them from releasing all contract data publicly. There would have been some embarrassed businesses and member states, but the practice of invoice padding would have been nipped in the bud. The whole process of selecting oil buyers should have been exposed to the light of scrutiny with the public release of oil contract information and an insistence by the UN that all oil purchasers publish shareholder or beneficiary lists. UN officials again excused themselves by claiming that Iraq could choose its own customers as long as those customers were also approved by the relevant member state. As a result the UN found itself involved in financial transactions with weapons dealers, money launderers, organized crime and terrorists. This was inexcusable. UN monitors should have acted like the weapons inspectors and been far more aggressive. UN personnel had the right and obligation to monitor any distribution of goods inside Iraq. The great majority of them never left their office and relied exclusively on the government of Saddam Hussein to tell them where and to whom the goods were distributed. WE WILL BE PAYING FOR THIS FOR A LONG TIME Even though the oil for food program was shut down nearly two years ago, the scandal is not receding into history. The oil for food program took place during the former Soviet Bloc's transition from a command to a competitive economy. It took place during a generational change in many of the ruling families in the Middle East. It took place during the emergence of new economic powerhouses China and India. During times of political and economic ferment, these countries were major players in the oil for food scandal. Officials from all of these countries, who may be in power for decades to come, took away a clear lesson. The ground rules of the new global economy have not yet been written in stone. While some argue for transparency, accountability and a level playing field, others maneuver for insider advantage and see bribery and corruption as acceptable business tools. The oil for food program gave a tremendous boost towards the institutionalization of corruption within the global economy, the repercussions of which have barely begun to emerge. Mr. Whitfield. Thank you very much. Mr. Smego. TESTIMONY OF D. ROBERT SMEGO Mr. Smego. Good afternoon, Mr. Chairman. My name is D. Robert Smego. I was retained by the House Energy and Commerce Committee earlier this year to review, identify, and translate documents it provided to me. I am an Arabic linguist knowledgeable--excuse me. I'm a linguist knowledgeable in the Arabic language. The House Energy and Commerce Committee's majority counsel asked me to identify by topic and translate documents regarding Oil-for-Food, in particular, Iraqi State Oil Marketing Organization documents that had been scanned on to DVDs and memoranda prepared by the Iraqi Intelligence Service. With the assistance of a native Iraqi linguist, I translated 49 documents from more than 23,000 pages that I have reviewed for this committee. The translated documents presented today accurately reflect the original text. I have not corrected the English translations of grammatical errors such as run-on sentences, indefinite pronouns, and sentence fragments that result from the melodious flow and verbose nature of Arabic. I avoided summarizing, paraphrasing, or making analytic substitutions for the original language. Any redactions in the original documents were maintained in the translations. I was asked to translate and interpret specific documents; I was not tasked to perform any broader analysis or develop a professional judgment about the broader context of these documents. The guidance of the majority counsel was to sift through large volumes of material looking for references to particular topics and to translate the documents selected for presentation to the committee. The documents presented here today provide useful insight into the activities of the former Iraqi regime. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I am pleased to appear before this subcommittee, and will be glad to address the questions within the scope of the work I performed for the committee. This concludes my opening statement. [The prepared statement of D. Robert Smego follows:] Prepared Statement of D. Robert Smego Good afternoon, Mr. Chairman. My name is D. Robert Smego. I was retained by the House Energy and Commerce Committee earlier this year to review, identify and translate documents it provided to me. I am a linguist knowledgeable in the Arabic language. The House Energy and Commerce Committee's Majority Counsel asked me to identify by topic and translate documents regarding Oil-For-Food, in particular Iraqi State Oil Marketing Organization documents that had been scanned onto DVDs and memoranda prepared by the Iraqi Intelligence Service. With the assistance of a native Iraqi linguist, I translated 49 documents from more than 23,000 pages that I reviewed for this Committee. The translated documents presented today accurately reflect the original text. I have not corrected the English translations of grammatical errors, such as run-on sentences, indefinite pronouns, and sentence fragments that result from the melodious flow and verbose nature of Arabic. I avoided summarizing, paraphrasing, or making analytic substitutions for the original language. Any redactions in the original documents were maintained in the translations. I was asked to translate and interpret specific documents. I was not tasked to perform any broader analysis or to develop a professional judgment about the broader context of these documents. The guidance of the Majority Counsel was to sift through large volumes of material looking for references to particular topics and to translate the documents selected by the Majority Counsel for presentation to the Committee. The documents presented here today provide useful insight into the activities of the former Iraqi regime. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. This concludes my opening statement. I am pleased to appear before this Subcommittee and will be glad to address questions within the scope of the work I performed for the Committee. Mr. Whitfield. Thank you, Mr. Smego. Dr. Gordon, you are recognized for 5 minutes. TESTIMONY OF JOY GORDON Ms. Gordon. I appreciate the opportunity to speak before this committee. My background is in political philosophy and law. I have been doing research on economic sanctions for 7 years. Over the last 5 years, I have published on the Iraq sanctions in the Yield Journal of International Human Rights Law, Ethics and International Affairs, Middle East report, Le Monde Diplomatique, and Harper's Magazine. I am currently completing a book on the Iraq sanctions regime for Harvard University Press. I would like to begin by mentioning a crucial distinction between the U.N. Taken broadly and the Security Council. Many of the accusations that have been lobbied against the United Nations regarding the Oil-for-Food program, in fact, go to decisions on the part of the Security Council itself or actions or failures to act on the part of the member states of the Security Council. I would like to briefly address a common misconception. It is often said that there was no oversight or monitoring or accountability in the Oil-for-Food program. That's incorrect. There were, by my count, seven levels of oversight and monitoring. All of these are publicly available. At the first level was something called distribution plan; before Iraq could contract for a single item, it had to submit an itemized list of every single item it wished to contract for in the next 6 months. Those distribution plans are and have always been posted on the OIP Web site. They are not a secret. Every item was approved. The next thing was that once Iraq contracted, the contract initially went through the OIP and then to every single member of the Security Council. Every single member of the 661 Committee had the right to block or delay or question any contract indefinitely for any reason. In those cases where there were concerns, for example, the U.S. was primarily concerned with security issues, the U.S. could block a contract, and it did so for $5.4 billion of contracts. The U.S. and to some extent the U.K. Could delay contracts by asking for information, and in many cases those requests for information delayed contracts by as much as 2 years. So it was more than possible for the United States to intervene in blocking or delaying any contract that raised any concern to the U.S. in any form. Next, once the goods were purchased, all funds went directly through an escrow account. There were no legal funds that went through the Iraqi government at all. Funds were--oil proceeds went to an escrow account; contracts were paid from the escrow account. There were onsite inspectors Cotecna and Lloyds Register, for the goods' arrival. And, finally, there were hundreds of U.N. Staff on the ground in Iraq to document of the distribution of goods, the use of goods, whether they arrived at the end user, whether they were consumed by the end user correctly. Oil sales similarly had multi levels of supervision. The Iraqi government it is sometimes said was free to pick prices and to set prices low. That is patently incorrect. It had no such authority. SOMO had the authority to propose a price. The pricing formula for each month period was reviewed by the oil overseers. If the oil overseers found it to be consistent with fair market value, it recommended approval to the 661 Committee. The 661 Committee, again, every member had the right to block the approval of that formula at any time. It did not require consensus, it did not require agreement of any others. The companies who were contracting for oil sales similarly went through the same process. Every company had to be registered. Registration did not mean that OIP reviewed them; it meant simply that the permanent nation--the permanent mission of that nation to the United Nations submitted a list, information about that company, its name and address. Once it did that, then any member of the 661 Committee could refuse to have that company on the list. If the price was approved by the 661 Committee and the company had been approved by the 661 Committee, then the oil overseers went forward with the approval of the oil contract. Any member of the 661 Committee, including the U.S., could stop the pricing if it ever looked unfair or for any other reason. And it could block any company if that company looked corrupt or for any other reason. Let me address some of the concerns that have come up repeatedly over the last year. There have been a lot of discussion about the kickbacks, that contracts were routinely inflated by 5 to 10 percent, and that that amount was received in cash under the table by the Iraqi government. In fact--and it is often--the U.N. Is often charged with a failure to supervise or negligence in permitting this to take place. That is not correct. In those cases where the price irregularities were clear, U.N. Staff, the OIP staff went to the 661 Committee and said: Here is a contract where the pricing is clearly improper. Do you want to block it? It was not within the authority of the United Nations' personnel to stop the contract; it was only within their authority to provide information to and to advise the members of the 661 Committee. It was the responsibility of the members of the 661 Committee to block a contract for that reason or for any other reason. On those more than 70 occasions where OIP staff identified such extreme price irregularities as to clearly indicate kickbacks, it went to the 661 Committee. On none of those occasions did any member state, including the United States, choose to take action to block that contract. In cases where the--and those were in cases where the irregularities were glaring. In cases where the irregularities were 5 to 10 percent, they were difficult to detect, but even if they had been detected we have to assume that the members of the Security Council would not have been inclined to act any differently for minor increases of 5 to 10 percent if they were not prepared to block contracts where the price irregularities were very extreme. Let us look quickly at oil surcharges. Mr. Whitfield. Dr. Gordon, you are also about a minute and 15 seconds over. So if you could summarize, we would appreciate it. Ms. Gordon. Okay. As I said before, for the oil surcharges, what's--it is the case that for all oil sales--I'm sorry. Again, it was the oil overseers, it was the staff of the U.N. That brought the oil surcharges to the attention of the 661 Committee as soon as they became apparent. That was in the fall of 2000. In that case, unlike with the import contracts, the Security Council chose to respond and to put in place a very Draconian measure. However, you cannot lay blame on the U.N. Staff. In both cases, they advised the Committee correctly. In one case, the committee chose to take action; in the other case, it did not. I would like to emphasize that the smuggling was by far the largest amount of the illicit funds that went to Iraq by any measurement, whether it is the GAO, the Volcker report, or the Duelfer Report. And of the smuggling, about three quarters was through Jordan and Turkey combined. That again, we now well know was with the approval and full knowledge of the United States in particular. And I--and I will just end my statement there. [The prepared statement of Joy Gordon follows:] Prepared Statement of Joy Gordon, Professor of Philosophy, Fairfield University Mr. Chairman and distinguished members of the committee: Thank you for this opportunity to testify before this committee. In taking on the difficult endeavor of unraveling the complexities of the Oil for Food Program, this committee is undertaking a tremendously important task, and it is a pleasure to be invited to contribute to that work. This program, its successes and its failures, has broad implications for future US foreign policy, as well as for the future of the United Nations. My testimony today is based on the research I have done in the field of economic sanctions over the last seven years, including a close study of the Iraq sanctions process from 1990 to 2003. In the course of my research I have become familiar with the scholarly work on economic sanctions in general and on the Iraq sanctions in particular, as well as much of the extensive body of documents generated in the course of the Oil for Food Program. Over the last five years I have also interviewed many of those involved in the 661 Committee--the committee of the Security Council charged with overseeing the sanctions regime imposed on Iraq--and the OFF program. Over the last year we have heard much about the failures of the Oil for Food Program. A great deal has been blamed on the Secretary-General for what is seen as an institutional failure on the part of the United Nations. As many have noted, there have been failures on the part of nearly everyone involved with the program. Most recently the Volcker Committee has explored the ethical problems involving Cotecna; the possibility of serious improprieties on the part of Benon Sevan, the director of the program; and a critical concern about the scope of the program's audits. But in recent months there has been growing recognition of the extent to which the Oil for Food Program, as well as much of the oversight, was in fact in the hands of the Security Council and its member states--including the United States--not the Secretariat. In my testimony today I'd like to address a number of issues concerning the Oil for Food Program and the accusations against it: 1. The effectiveness of the program 2. The magnitude of the accusations 3. Transparency and oversight Monitoring of import contracts Monitoring of oil sales Transparency 4. Sources of illicit funds Overland smuggling Maritime smuggling Kickbacks on import contracts Oil surcharges Iraq's freedom to choose its trade partners 5. The Volcker Committee reports 6. Who was responsible? The consensus decision making rule The US role The State Department's defense of US support for Iraq's illicit trade of Jordan and Turkey 7. Conclusions 1. The effectiveness of the program I think it is important to begin by recognizing that the Oil for Food Program, and the UN staff involved, were in fact tremendously successful at raising the quality of life for the Iraqi population, in very measurable ways. The nutritional intake nearly doubled, and acute malnutrition in children dropped by half. The health care system was much better able to meet the population's needs--surgical operations increased by 40%; polio was eliminated, and communicable diseases were substantially reduced. Water and sanitation improved considerably, and electricity became much more reliable. We should be particularly conscious of the significance of these accomplishments as we see how difficult it is been in the last two years for the US occupation authority and the interim Iraqi government to achieve similar standards. This has been particularly true as the security situation has deteriorated, and will probably worsen as funds for reconstruction are reallocated to security costs. The fundamental goal of the Oil for Food Program was to improve the lives of the Iraqi population through the import of critical humanitarian goods, and that was unquestionably achieved. The magnitude of the accusations While it is common to hear that Saddam Hussein's regime received $11 billion in illicit funds through the Oil for Food Program (or more recently, $21 billion), in fact the credible accusations are much more limited: that the former Iraqi regime obtained somewhere between $2 billion and $4.4 billion through oil surcharges and import contracts. According to both the GAO reports from 2004 and the CIA's report from last September, the bulk of the illicit funds that entered Iraq came from oil smuggling--which took place prior to the Oil for Food Program, and after 1996 occurred entirely outside the program. As earlier congressional hearings have made clear, Iraq had ongoing trade with Jordan, Turkey, and Syria for many years. The major GAO report maintained that from 1997 through 2002, the former Iraqi regime acquired $10.1 billion in illegal revenues related to the Oil for Food Program.'' <SUP>1</SUP> $5.7 of this came from oil smuggling and $4.4 billion from illicit surcharges on oil sales and commissions on imports.<SUP>2</SUP> The report of the CIA's Iraq Study Group maintains that the bulk of Iraq's illicit funds came from ``government to government protocols''--ongoing trade agreements between Iraq and other countries, in violation of the sanctions. Iraq's income from these, according to the report, came to some $8 billion, while kickbacks from import contracts were estimated to be $1.5 billion, surcharges from oil sales were $229 million, and private sector smuggling was estimated at $1.2 billion.<SUP>3</SUP> --------------------------------------------------------------------------- \1\ ``United Nations: Observations on the Oil for Food Program,'' Statement of Joseph A. Christoff, Director, International Affairs and Trade. Testimony before the Committee on Foreign Relations, U.S. Senate. GAO-04-65IT, p. 2. \2\ ``United Nations: Observations on the Oil for Food Program,'' Statement of Joseph A. Christoff, Director, International Affairs and Trade. Testimony before the Committee on Foreign Relations, U.S. Senate. GAO-04-65IT, p. 2 \3\ ``Comprehensive Report of the Special Advisor to the DCI on Iraq's WMD,'' 30 September 2004, Regime finance and procurement section, p. 23. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Thus, the most credible accusations--the GAO and ISG reports-- maintain that the Iraqi regime illicitly received at most $4.4 billion via some aspect of the Oil for Food Program. 3. Transparency and Oversight I'd like to address some common misconceptions about the program. Over the last year we've heard people say many times that the Oil for Food program had no system of oversight or monitoring, and that there was no transparency. It in fact had an elaborate system of oversight, and there was an enormous amount of information about the program and its operations that was not only available to the UN and the member states, but in fact was maintained for the public on the web site of OIP (Office of Iraq Programme), the agency established within the UN to house the Oil for Food Program and the UN's other Iraq programs. It is important to understand that to the extent there were kickbacks or improprieties within the program, this occurred not because of a lack of systematic monitoring; but rather took place in spite of an elaborate monitoring system. This monitoring system involved detailed oversight by members of the Security Council, including extensive participation by the United States and the United Kingdom, each of which received copies of all contracts made by the government of Iraq for every purchase of humanitarian supplies and oil spare parts. It was OIP staff--customs officers--who notified the 661 Committee of possible kickbacks on import contracts, on more than seventy occasions. No member of the 661 Committee, including the US, then exercised its right to block or delay the contract. It was OIP staff--the oil overseers--who notified the 661 Committee of oil surcharges in October 2000. The US and UK then began withholding pricing approval in response. A. Monitoring of import contracts Briefly, the multi-tiered monitoring structure for south/center Iraq <SUP>4</SUP> was: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- \4\ Note that in northern Iraq the UN executed the program on behalf of the government of Iraq, and in that capacity took over some governmental functions. In south/center Iraq, the Iraqi government continued to perform normal governmental functions, but was monitored. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1. Distribution plan: Before an application could be submitted that would allow Iraq to import goods, Iraq was required to submit an exhaustive list of every single item it wished to import, identifying quantities and sectors where goods would be used, and the justification for prioritizing these goods. The Distribution Plan then had to be reviewed and approved by UN staff, often with modifications. 2. OIP review: Once a contract was negotiated between the Iraqi government and the supplier, it was submitted to OIP. OIP staff reviewed it to see that it contained all the information required by the 661 Committee, and corresponded to the Distribution Plan 3. UNSCOM/UNMOVIC: The contract was also sent to UNSCOM (later UNMOVIC) and IAEA, to determine if there were any military or dual use goods 4. 661 Committee review: The contract was circulated to every member of the 661 Committee.<SUP>5</SUP> Each member had the option of delaying the contract, asking for more information, or simply vetoing it. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- \5\ Some goods that the Security Council considered uncontroversial were eventually put on a ``green list'' that bypassed the committee (pursuant to Security Council Resolution 1409) but went through all the other monitoring stages. However, where OIP staff found irregularities in ``green list'' contracts, they then presented those to the 661Committee. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- 5. Escrow account: Under the terms of the program as designed, no program funds ever went directly through the hands of the Iraqi government. All proceeds from legal oil sales went into a UN-held escrow account, and all import contracts were paid for from this account. 6. On-site inspectors: Upon arrival in Iraq, the goods were inspected by Lloyd's Register (later Cotecna) to see that the quantities conformed to the contract 7. End use monitors: Once the goods were in Iraq, staff from the UN agencies conducted thousands of site visits, surveys, and spot checks to determine if the goods were being distributed equitably and efficiently, and to gauge the adequacy of the program. B. For oil sales: 1. The Iraqi government proposed pricing formulas, which were then reviewed by oil overseers and submitted to the 661 Committee for approval. 2. Every oil contract, including the prices, delivery specifications, and all contract terms, was reviewed by ``oil overseers''--consultants from the oil industry, hired by the Secretary General, with the approval of the members of the Security Council. They advised the 661 Committee of any irregularities. 3. Every member of the 661 Committee had the opportunity to review any contract. Any oil contract could be vetoed by any member of the 661 Committee. C. Transparency In many ways the program was highly transparent. There was a considerable amount of information easily available to the general public at all times, and there was even more information available to the members of the Security Council, which was overseeing the program. The Distribution Plans, showing every item that the UN permitted Iraq to contract for, for every phase of the program, were (and for phases 5-13 continue to be) posted on the OIP web site The Secretary General provided reports every ninety days on the program, including detailed information on both oil sales and import contracts, and on the situation in every sector of the Iraqi economy and society, including health, agriculture and nutrition, education, electricity production, telecommunications, transportation, de-mining. All of these reports were (and still are) posted on the OIP web site For every 6-month phase, OIP posted charts showing the status of both oil contracts and import contracts: for every sector of the economy, how many contracts had been submitted, how many approved, how much had been delivered, etc. All of these were posted for each phase on the OIP web site. OIP issued weekly updates with details of oil liftings, status of holds on particular contracts, and other items. All of these were (and are) posted on the OIP web site. The OIP web site also listed every Security Council resolution, Secretary-General report, and every other major report on the program. These were (and still are) posted on the OIP web site. The transparency of the Oil for Food Program stands in marked contrast with the way that the sanctions program had operated in the first half of the 1990s. From 1990-1995, Iraq was permitted to apply to the 661 Committee for permission to purchase humanitarian goods (although it could not sell oil to generate funds). However, the 661 Committee was extremely inconsistent in what items it would permit and what it would not; refused to generate any guidelines or criteria that would allow suppliers or the government of Iraq to know what was permitted and what was not; was often inconsistent, permitting a contract for certain goods, such as ambulance tires, on one occasion, and then a few months later denying a contract for similar goods; and once it denied a contract, it would not provide the government of Iraq or the supplier with any information as to why the goods were denied. 4. Who was responsible? For many months now we've heard accusations leveled against ``the UN'' for allowing Saddam Hussein to garner illicit funds through the Oil for Food Program. There are some in Congress and elsewhere calling for Kofi Annan's resignation. Yet the Secretariat had no decision making role in setting the terms of the Oil for Food Program. The program itself was a product of a Security Council resolution; all subsequent modifications to the program were established through Security Council resolutions; and implementation of the program, including OIP, was overseen by the 661 Committee, which made the decisions regarding implementation. Under Article 41 of the UN Charter, it was the responsibility of the Security Council, not the Secretariat, to enforce the sanctions regime. The role of the Secretariat was limited to execution of the program, as the program had been designed by the Security Council; as well as providing the Council members with information, and performing administrative functions. The Security Council and its members, including the United States, played critical roles in allowing smuggling and kickbacks to take place. A. Smuggling The bulk of Iraq's illicit income, according to the GAO and the CIA's Iraq Study Group, was from smuggling: $5.7 billion according to the GAO, and $8 billion according to the ISG. According to the ISG report, the majority of this trade--$4.4 billion--was with Jordan. A significant amount of illicit trade ($710 million) was with Turkey. According to the ISG report, in 1991 Jordan informed the Council of its intention to continue trading with Iraq, and the Council ``took note,'' but took no measures to reprimand or prevent Jordan from going forward with large-scale, prohibited trade. Similarly, in the case of Turkey, the Council turned a blind eye to large-scale illicit trade. This included the US, which had a strategic alliance with Turkey. All three US administrations over the course of the sanctions regime sent waivers to Congress, asking that aid be continued to Jordan and Turkey despite their illicit trade with Iraq. B. Maritime smuggling In addition to overland smuggling, there was substantial maritime smuggling as well. The Multinational Interception Force (MIF) was charged with interdicting ships engaged in illegal trade with Iraq. The MIF was created by Security Council Resolution 665, which called upon member states with naval forces in the area to intervene to enforce the sanctions. According to its reports, the MIF was quite active, boarding hundreds of ships each year,<SUP>6</SUP> and there is no reason to suggest that it was incompetent or poorly run. However, it makes little sense to blame the UN for failing to stop Iraq's illicit oil smuggling. There was no authorization for any UN entity to take actions to intervene; SCR 665 only invited member states to take these measures. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- \6\ From 1994 to 2001, there were several hundred boardings per year; in 2002 and 2003, there were over 3000 boardings per year. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- The MIF involved some participation, at various points, from twenty or so different nations. But it was overwhelmingly dominated by US naval forces. The commanders at every point in the MIF's history were US naval rear admirals or vice admirals in the US Fifth Fleet.<SUP>7</SUP> The force itself consisted overwhelmingly of US ships. In 2000, for example, the US contributed 86 vessels; the UK seven vessels; Canada contributed one vessel for two months, and the Netherlands contributed one vessel for one month.<SUP>8</SUP> MIF commanders periodically reported to the 661 Committee. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- \7\ The commanders of the MIF were Rear Admiral A.K. Taylor (1991- 1992); Vice Admiral D.J. Katz (1992-1994); Vice Admiral J.S. Redd (1994-1996); Vice Admiral T.B. Fargo (1996-1998); Vice Admiral C.W. Moore Jr. (1998-2002); and Vice Admiral T.J. Keating (2002-2003). \8\ In 2001, the US contributed 90 vessels, the UK contributed four, and all other participating countries contributed one or two. In 2002, the US contributed 99 vessels, five nations contributed ten or more, and several other countries contributed less than ten. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Kickbacks on import contracts OIP has been accused of failing to stop illegal kickbacks. However, OIP had no authority to block improper contracts. It was authorized to request clarification in the case of irregularities, and provide that information to the 661 committee. Only the members of the Security Council had the power to block contracts. Where price irregularities were clear, the customs officers of the OIP staff did in fact inform the 661 Committee, giving each member the opportunity to block the contract, or to ask for further information before approving. On over 70 occasions, this was done. On none of those occasions did any member of the Council--including the US--seek to delay or block the contract for pricing irregularities. D. Oil surcharges In October 2000, while reviewing Iraq's proposed pricing formulas, the oil overseers noted that the proposed formulas did not reflect fair market value. In their contacts with potential oil buyers, they learned that the Iraqi authorities had started requesting payment of a surcharge of up to 50 cents per barrel. The oil overseers reported both of these facts to the 661 Committee. In March 2001, the Secretary General drew attention to this problem in a public report to the Security Council. In response to this information, the US and UK implemented a ``retroactive pricing policy.'' The normal practice in the industry, and for the Oil for Food Program, was to set the price for the coming month. Under retroactive pricing, the US and the UK withheld their approval for the price until the month had passed. This meant that buyers literally were required to sign contracts for oil purchases without knowing what the price was until after they were committed. The US and UK took the position that this allowed the committee to determine retroactively what the fair market value of the oil had been the previous month, and charge buyers accordingly. Thus, the argument went, Iraq was receiving no more nor less than fair market value; that eliminated the premia that went to middlemen; and consequently eliminated the possibility that the middlemen would pay Iraq illicit surcharges. The new pricing policies did in fact eliminate any margin for surcharges. But it had another result as well: that oil sales were substantially compromised. Predictably, few buyers were prepared to purchase Iraqi oil without knowing the price. It did not help much to provide assurances that the price they were ultimately charged would be ``fair market value,'' as determined by the 661 Committee. As a result, the retroactive pricing mechanism created a financial crisis in the OFF program from 2001-2003. In 2001, oil exports averaged 1.7 million barrels per day. In 2002, the average was 1.1 million BPD. By September 2002, that number had dropped to 400,000 BPD. The result was a dramatic shortfall in funding for humanitarian contracts. As of February 2002, there were nearly 700 fully approved contracts, with a value of $1.6 billion, for which there was no funding; and another $5.3 billion of contracts on hold, awaiting approval; for a total potential shortfall of $6.9 billion. One member of the 661 Committee noted that ``exports are now so low that the program is on the verge of collapsing.'' <SUP>9</SUP> Income remained at this reduced level for the duration of the program.<SUP>10</SUP> --------------------------------------------------------------------------- \9\ In June 2001 Iraq stopped producing oil in protest against a US proposal to modify the sanctions regime, and in April 2002 Iraq again declared a moratorium, to protest Israel's treatment of Palestinians. However, the retroactive pricing mechanism was by far the major factor in the financial crisis of the OFF program from 2001-2003. \10\ Income from oil exports increased steadily for the first eight phases, from $2.1 billion in Phase 1 to $9.6 billion in Phase 8, which ended in December 2000. For Phase 9, the oil exports fell to $5.6 billion; Phase 10, $5.4 billion; Phase 11, $4.6 billion; Phase 12, $5.6 billion; Phase 13, $4.4 billion. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- E. Iraq's freedom to choose its trade partners The CIA's report makes much of the ``secret oil voucher'' system, by which Iraq designated oil purchasers. However, this appears for the most part to be simply Iraq's record-keeping system for exercising the rights it had under the terms of the OFF program to select its trading partners. While it may be said that particular purchasers should not have been approved, the fundamental decision to allow Iraq to choose its oil buyers and import contractors--and the political leverage that accompanied that--was a decision made by the Security Council, with the participation and agreement of the United States. It may be that the Council felt that the elaborate system of monitoring and the multi- tiered approval process would serve as a sufficient mechanism of oversight. But the decision to allow Iraq to select its trading partners was not a failure of judgment or oversight on the part of the Secretariat. It was a decision of the Security Council, with the agreement of the United States. 5. The Volcker Committee Reports In its February report, the overall finding of the Volcker Committee regarding the account discussed (the 2.2% account) was that it was run carefully and well. The reports generated by the Independent Inquiry Committee chaired by Paul Volcker have been by far the most rigorous and careful studies of the accusations against the Oil for Food Program to date. Of the accusations addressed in the IIC's reports thus far, some concern the operation of the program; some concern individual acts which did not have significant effects on the program; some improprieties served the interests of the Iraqi government, and some did not. The most significant issue concerning the program's structure was the claim that the OFF program should have conducted internal audits. This issue raised by the Volcker Committee goes to one of the fundamental problems in the basic structure of the program: that it was a program created, designed, and enforced by the Security Council under its powers in Chapter VII, but administered by the Secretariat. There is no provision in the UN Charter for the Secretariat to override or modify any decision by the Security Council, in any form. Under the terms of the program's mandate, contained primarily in Security Council Resolution 986 and the Memorandum of Understanding, only external audits were authorized. According to the February report of the Volcker Committee, these were conducted and submitted to the Security Council, as required. Under standard UN practice, contracts to which the UN is a party are audited; but the import and export contracts in the OFF program took place between Iraq and commercial enterprises. While we may now say that internal audits should have been conducted, or that the import and export contracts should have been audited, that was not how the Security Council chose to design the program, and the Secretariat did not have authority to override the Security Council on these or any other aspects of the OFF program. The other major issues discussed in the Volcker Committee reports released to date do not indicate that program's basic structure or operations were fundamentally compromised: A great deal has been said about the claim that Kofi Annan's son may have been involved in the decision to award an inspection contract to Cotecna. But while this issue has gotten enormous attention from the media, it is not a significant factor in the operation of the Oil for Food Program. The Cotecna contract involved a minor part of the program (the 2.2% account). Further, the accusation is that the contract was improperly awarded to Cotecna; not that Iraq's humanitarian imports were compromised by any practices of Cotecna. The improprieties in contracting identified by the Volcker Committee in the February report indicate that the program was subject to a series of manipulations for political purposes, but that these generally did not in fact serve the interests of the Iraqi government. The report of February 3 notes that of the three major contracts under the 2.2% account, only one (the banking contract) was awarded with the agreement of the Iraqi government; and that arrangement had the support of the US and UK. The Saybolt contract was improperly awarded to a Dutch company, on the grounds that the Netherlands supported the enforcement of sanctions against Iraq. The inspection contract to Lloyd's Register was improperly awarded to a British company, through the influence of the British Mission to the UN. The Volcker Committee gives evidence for serious concerns that Benon Sevan improperly received $160,000 through his involvement with one company that bought Iraqi oil through the program. If true, Sevan's actions would clearly be improper and may be illegal as well. However, it is not clear that Sevan in fact used his position to serve illicit interests on the part of the Iraqi government. The Volcker report indicates that the Iraqi government wanted Sevan to use his influence to persuade the Security council members to lift holds on oil spare parts and equipment. The Volcker report notes that the Iraqi government was disappointed that Sevan did not do so, and cancelled further oil allocations. In fact, Sevan did argue for lifting holds on oil spares parts and equipment, on the grounds that these were necessary for oil extraction. But that was also the position held by the oil overseers, as well as most members of the Security Council. 6. Who was responsible? A. The consensus decision making rule Prior witnesses at these hearings have suggested that the consensus requirement of the 661 Committee made it difficult to establish effective oversight of the Oil for Food program. However, for the most part the consensus requirement in fact operated in exactly the opposite way: in the absence of consensus, the default position was denial of import or oil sales, not approval. In most contexts, the consensus requirement did not prevent unilateral US action. It was in fact the structure that enabled the US to impose many policies and decisions unilaterally. Import contracts: All contracts (except those eventually included on the Green List) were circulated to every member of the 661 Committee, and required the approval of every member of the Committee. Thus, any single member could block any contract, regardless of whether other members objected. The United States unilaterally blocked massive quantities of import contracts, citing security concerns. It was occasionally joined by the UK, but the overwhelming majority of the holds (typically 90-95% at any point in time) were imposed by the US and the US alone. Oil contracts: the US, joined by the UK, used the consensus rule to delay approval of oil pricing, and did so over the objections of others in the Council until October 2001, when the 661 Committee finally agreed to retroactive oil pricing. The negotiation of ``rollover'' resolutions (the Security Council resolutions extending the program for an additional six months) were occasions for dispute. On one hand, there was considerable controversy over US holds on humanitarian goods; on the other hand, the US and UK would raise the issue of smuggling, and seek to include stronger measures against smuggling in the rollover resolution. On these occasions, France and Russia opposed such measures, arguably because of their own interests. However, it appears that the US also had little credibility on this issue with the committee, since the US did not want to enforce such measures against its allies, Jordan and Turkey, but only against other nations. B. What was the US role? The history of the program does not support the claim that the US was concerned about illicit funds entering Iraq, or would have done more if it had not been stymied by other members of the council. By all accounts, and based upon the US policies and decisions, the US was singularly preoccupied with military concerns, in particular WMD. The US blocked billions of dollars of import contracts--$150 million as of November 1998, then growing to $5 billion as of July 2002. All of these were blocked on the grounds that they contained items that could have military applications, or else contributed to Iraq's infrastructure, thereby creating the possibility of rebuilding its military capacity. There was nothing in the 661 Committee's procedures that prevented the US from blocking questionable contracts, for either imports or oil sales. To the contrary, the consensus rule was the mechanism that allowed the US to impose far greater restrictions on import and oil sales than other members of the Security Council supported. The US declined to block any of the import contracts presented, on the more than seventy occasions on which the US and the other member states were explicitly informed by UN staff of pricing irregularities suggesting possible kickbacks. US officials did on occasion report rumors of kickbacks and ask for investigations. However, when asked to provide specifics that could be investigated, US officials failed to provide any information on which to base an investigation. All three US administrations explicitly permitted large-scale illicit overland trade between Iraq and Jordan, and between Iraq and Turkey, throughout the history of the sanctions regime. To the extent that there was maritime smuggling, this occurred not through failures on the part of the UN, but rather on the watch of the US Fifth Fleet. The MIF fleet was overwhelmingly made up of vessels from the US Fifth Fleet, and was at all times commanded by US naval officers. The US approved the hire of every oil overseer hired by the Secretariat When the oil overseers--UN staff--informed the 661 Committee of pricing irregularities in oil sales, the US and UK implemented a harsh policy of retroactive pricing. Far from being stymied by other members on the Council, this practice began despite the objections of others on the Council. The US voted for Security Council Resolution 986 and agreed to the Memorandum of Understanding, which gave the government of Iraq the right to select its trading partners. This was crucial in permitting Iraq to use the OFF program to generate political support. The US voted for Security Council Resolution 986, which only required the OFF program to be subject to external audits, not internal audits. C. The State Department's defense of US support for Iraq's illicit trade with Jordan and Turkey In the congressional hearings that have taken place over the last several months, it has become known publicly what research specialists have known for the entire Iraqi sanctions episode--that all three US administrations turned a blind eye to this smuggling, and in fact took efforts to prevent the imposition of penalties under US law.<SUP>11</SUP> Despite more than a year of harsh attacks on the United Nations--particularly the Secretariat--for claimed mismanagement of the Oil for Food Program, the fact is that the bulk of the illicit funds that the Iraqi regime acquired in fact had nothing to do with the Oil for Food Program. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- \11\ As Mr. Schweich explained in his testimony, since 1991, under federal law there have been restrictions on US assistance to countries not in compliance with Security Council sanctions against Iraq. However, all three administrations filed waivers with Congress throughout the history of the sanctions regime, finding that it was in the national interest to provide aid despite these violations. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- It is clearly a matter of some embarrassment to the State Department that the United States itself knew, approved of, and took efforts to protect the ongoing smuggling which generated the majority of these funds, specifically in regard to Turkey and Jordan. The current response of the State Department is that this smuggling was legitimate and transparent, unlike that smuggling, done by Syria, or other corrupt practices such as kickbacks and bribery. Such a claim seems quite absurd in light of the actual history of US policy choices. In light of the research conducted by Dr. Paul Conlon, who testified before Congress last month, it is not correct to portray Jordan as being honest and above-board, when there was evidence from nearly the beginning that Jordan misrepresented its activities to the Committee on an ongoing basis. Indeed, it was Dr. Conlon himself who wrote the report informing the 661 Committee of this.<SUP>12</SUP> --------------------------------------------------------------------------- \12\ ``Data on Iraqi Trade/Rev.3,'' memorandum dated 1 December 1993 from Paul Conlon to James C. Ngobi --------------------------------------------------------------------------- In the case of Turkey, it was precisely the fault of the United States that Turkey's ongoing illicit trade was not granted any legitimacy. Whereas other countries on the 661 Committee repeatedly asked that Turkey's appeal for relief under Article 50 be considered, and Turkey placed this on the Committee's agenda over a dozen times, it was the United States (occasionally joined by the UK) that blocked the Committee from considering Turkey's request. The State Department's current position In his testimony on April 12 before the House Committee on Government Reform, Thomas Schweich of the State Department maintained that the large-scale ongoing illegal trade that Iraq maintained with Jordan and Turkey was ``in no way comparable to the kind of corruption, bribery, or kick backs'' that have been investigated by congressional committees.<SUP>13</SUP> --------------------------------------------------------------------------- \13\ All quotes from Mr. Schweich are from the Federal News Service transcript of his testimony (unpaginated). --------------------------------------------------------------------------- According to Mr. Schweich, the 661 Committee's decision to turn a blind eye to Jordan's smuggling was ``not a back room deal.'' Rather, he said, in 1991 Jordan sought relief under Article 50 of the UN Charter, and the Committee never acted. Consequently, Jordan informed the Committee that a loss of trade with Iraq would cause considerable damage to its economy, and simply notified the Committee that it intended to continue importing oil from Iraq. The Committee ``took note'' of this without objection, and asked Jordan to report on its trade. Thus, according to Mr. Schweich, ``it wasn't really secretive.'' Similarly, according to Mr. Schweich, in 1996 Turkey requested Article 50 relief, also because of the consequences of sanctions on the economy. He stated: The Jordanian and Turkish protocols were done to alleviate economic hardship, it was an exception to the sanctions regime because of the severe consequences that a failing Jordanian and Turkish economy might have on the world, it was done transparently, openly with the knowledge of the entire 661 Committee and the international community and for a valid purpose. And to allow countries and individuals to equate that with the type of corruption that went on could seriously undermine our efforts to reform the UN that are going on now. Other countries, such as Syria, did not receive similar relief, according to Mr. Schweich; Turkey and Jordan, by contrast, ``came hat in hand, asked for Article 50 relief, and really did it by the book. Syria just engaged in massive fraud . . .'' Contrary to the State Department's claims, the open smuggling was never considered legal. There was clear favoritism based upon US strategic alliances, not altruism or international law; and the US in fact blocked attempts to grant proper, transparent, legal relief under Article 50. Jordan In his 1996 article ``How Legal Are Jordan's Oil Imports from Iraq?''' <SUP>14</SUP>, Dr. Paul Conlon wrote about this issue in great detail. He noted that: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- \14\ Florida State University Journal of Transnational Law & Policy, vol. 6 (Fall 1996). When India made a similar request, citing the Security Council's approval of Jordanian trade, it was rejected. In a formal opinion ``of considerable precision and clarity'' from the office of the UN's Legal Counsel, ``the Committee concluded that an exemption would be illegal.'' <SUP>15</SUP> --------------------------------------------------------------------------- \15\ Ibid., p. 112. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Although Jordan provided annual reports to the 661 Committee concerning its Iraq trade, by 1993 it was apparent that these reports were not truthful. Jordan's official reports to the UN data base on world trade reported much higher amounts.<SUP>16</SUP> An internal report regarding these discrepancies was circulated to multiple members of the 661 Committee, but the committee declined to discuss it.<SUP>17</SUP> --------------------------------------------------------------------------- \16\ Ibid., p. 115. \17\ Ibid., p. 116. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Research conducted in 1994 indicated that ``considerable manipulation was involved'' in Jordan's reports to the 661 Committee: Jordan's actual oil imports from Iraq--according to Jordan's own reports to other UN bodies--were 81% greater (in dollar value) than the amount it reported to the 661 Committee.<SUP>18</SUP> --------------------------------------------------------------------------- \18\ Ibid., p. 117. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- There in fact was no transparency on this issue. Some countries believed that the committee had actually granted Article 50 relief.<SUP>19</SUP> While the illicit trade was widely known, ``[o]riginally, the pseudo-agreement's existence was held to be a secret. It was never mentioned in any published UN document.'' <SUP>20</SUP> --------------------------------------------------------------------------- \19\ Ibid., p. 118. \20\ Ibid., p. 115. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- The practice of ``taking note'' of Jordan's practices, which occurred each year, had no basis in any relevant legal authority, either Article 50 or paragraph 23 of Resolution 687.<SUP>21</SUP> --------------------------------------------------------------------------- \21\ Ibid., p. 114. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- This arrangement continued well past any legitimate concerns with Jordan's inability to obtain substitute oil supplies. Far from seeking alternate sources of oil, Jordan actually increased its dependence on Iraqi oil during the sanctions regime.<SUP>22</SUP> --------------------------------------------------------------------------- \22\ Ibid., p. 116. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- In the case of Jordan, there was no transparency. An open secret of improper activities is not ``transparency.'' Nor could the 661 Committee view this as legal, in light of the legal opinion stating strongly that it was not. Turkey In a letter dated August 5, 1996, Turkey submitted a formal request to the 661 Committee for relief, citing the economic hardship due to trade disruption with Iraq resulting from the sanctions. Turkey sought permission to resume oil imports, and to in turn provide Iraq with goods for the civilian population. Far from supporting Turkey's appeal for Article 50 relief, the US delegate on the 661 Committee said in an August 1996 meeting (meeting no. 142) that Turkey's request would compromise the integrity of the sanctions regime, and that the matter should be postponed to a later time. The issue was raised again, and again, and again--in meeting 143 (August 28, 1996); meeting 144 (October 14, 1996); meeting 145 (December 3, 1996); meeting 146 (December 18, 1996); meeting 148 (January 28, 1997); meeting 150 (February 21, 1997); meeting 151 (March 17, 1997); meeting 152 (March 24, 1997); meeting 155 (May 14, 1997); meeting 157 (June 11, 1997); meeting 159 (July 17, 1997); meeting 160 (August 27, 1997); meeting 166 (January 4, 1998); meeting 171 (May 12, 1998); meeting 172 (June 18,1998); and meeting 176 (December 1, 1998). As the issue dragged on for years, the US position remained unchanged. Again and again, the US delegate reiterated the same position: that the view of the United States had not changed, thus blocking any possibility of considering Turkey's appeal for relief in a public, legal, and transparent form. It was the US who maintained that the Committee did not have authority to grant a sanctions exemption to Turkey--over the opposition of others on the 661 Committee. In one instance, the US objected to a French proposal that the Secretariat provide a report on the effects of the sanctions on neighboring states.<SUP>23</SUP> The delegates from China and Bahrain spoke in support of the proposal. However, the US (joined by the UK) refused to agree, thus preventing consensus (effectively vetoing) even a request to the Secretariat to provide information on the impact of sanctions on Turkey and other nations. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- \23\ Meeting 171, May 12, 1998. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Conclusion In the cases of Jordan and Turkey, the State Department currently maintains that the US did not approve of or participate in any impropriety, on the grounds that these arrangements were transparent and honest. They were not. 7. Conclusions The bulk of the illicit funds that arrived in Iraq over the course of the sanctions regime had no relation to the Oil for Food Program. They occurred through large-scale ongoing smuggling, which began well before the OFF program, and had no relation to the program at all. Contrary to common views, the Oil for Food Program did not ``give Saddam Hussein a free hand'' to use oil proceeds as he wished, without oversight or monitoring. Rather, the OFF program had multiple levels of oversight for both import contracts and oil sales, involving scrutiny by UN staff and by every member of the Security Council, of nearly every aspect of every transaction. To the extent that there were kickbacks or other improprieties in the program, these occurred not for lack of oversight; but rather occurred despite an elaborate system of oversight. Contrary to common views, the Oil for Food Program was not characterized by an absence of transparency. In many regards the program was highly transparent, not only to the members of the Security Council--which authorized and supervised the program--but to the general public as well. Contrary to common views, the UN Secretariat was not responsible for what are seen as the major failures of the program: the ability of Iraq to choose its trade partners; the kickbacks on import contracts; the surcharges on oil contracts; the large-scale smuggling. The design of the program, and the enforcement of the sanctions, was in the hands of the Security Council and its members, not the Secretariat. Contrary to common views, the US did not show significant concern regarding smuggling and kickbacks. Rather, the US was preoccupied with blocking military goods from entering Iraq. The US generally showed a lack of interest in stopping illegal funds from entering Iraq, and this was particularly true where US strategic allies were involved in illicit trade with Iraq. It is not plausible to attribute the poor humanitarian situation in Iraq to the failures of oversight of the Oil for Food program. These kickbacks and oil surcharges are estimated to be at most $4.4 billion, over the seven-year course of the program. What was far more damaging to Iraq's economy and society were the limitations that compromised oil sales (including retroactive oil pricing) and large-scale holds on equipment and goods necessary for infrastructure and for the operation of an industrialized society--electricity production, water and sewage treatment, telecommunications, transportation, construction, industrial production, agriculture. These were imposed almost entirely by the United States. US holds on critical humanitarian and infrastructure supplies at just one point in time--July 2002--totaled some $5 billion. In the end, the total goods that actually arrived in Iraq from the program's inception through May 2003 came to only $4.6 billion per year, or about $191 per person per year. The extreme impoverishment of the Iraqi population would not have been significantly affected if that amount were increased to $200 per person per year, which is approximately the difference that $4.4 billion would have made. We may be shocked that as much as $4.4 billion in illicit funds slipped through the oversight structures of the Oil for Food Program. But the reality is that in the face of such severe, longstanding, and widespread impoverishment, the actual impact of the kickbacks and surcharges that have been denounced by many as a scandal of historic proportions was in fact negligible in comparison to the economic sanctions themselves, and the additional strictures imposed by the US and the UK. Mr. Whitfield. Dr. Gordon, thank you very much. And I appreciate the testimony of all of you. I might say that Gerald Anderson will be testifying on the next panel, and I do know that in his testimony he is going to say that the U.S. and Britain made 40 attempts in formal and informal meetings with the 661 Committee to address the oil surcharge problem. Now, Mr. Smego, you testified that you reviewed more than 23,000 pages of documents or DVDs equivalent of 23,000 pages. Is that correct? Mr. Smego. That is correct, sir. Mr. Whitfield. And these are documents from the Iraqi Intelligence Service or the state oil ministry? Mr. Smego. The 23,000 pages were actually from a larger amount of 60,000 pages from the Iraqi State Oil Marketing Organization, otherwise known as SOMO. Mr. Whitfield. And did you translate Iraqi Intelligence Service memos? Mr. Smego. Yes. I also did translate nine documents from Iraqi Intelligence Service. Mr. Whitfield. And, now, you were with the Iraqi survey group for a period of time. When was that? Mr. Smego. That is correct. I was there from April 2004 to January 2005. Mr. Whitfield. Now, it appears that in some point in 2000, Saddam Hussein began demanding a surcharge on Iraqi oil contracts. During the course of your work, did you uncover any documents pertaining to those oil surcharges? Mr. Smego. Absolutely, sir. Mr. Whitfield. And which exhibit is that? Mr. Smego. Exhibit 1. Mr. Whitfield. And what does that say? Mr. Smego. Exhibit 1 is a handwritten document in English regarding contracts under the eighth phase of the Oil-for-Food program stating that the buyer--it is between the seller and the buyer--for the purchase of however many barrels of crude oil, and that a payment of so much dollars per barrel would be charged as a surcharge. Mr. Whitfield. And paid either directly in cash or to a SOMO bank account? Mr. Smego. That is correct. Mr. Whitfield. And who signed that document? Mr. Smego. At the first page, at the top left of the document it is signed by Amer Mohammed Rasheed, who was the minister of oil at that time. Mr. Whitfield. Okay. Now, during the course of your work for the committee, did you examine any documents that purport to show that Saddam Hussein and members of his regime used, or at least attempted to use oil allocations under the program to influence individuals and entities? Mr. Smego. Absolutely. Certain documents within the Iraqi Intelligence Service, for example, document 3--excuse me, Exhibit 3 in 1998 states that Iraq was planning to take a portion of its oil during the phase and distribute it to friendly companies and distinguished personalities. Approximately 80 million barrels ``to the friendly nations, companies, and political establishments,'' at the rates specified. Mr. Whitfield. Okay. And that was Exhibit 2 or 3? Mr. Smego. That was Exhibit 2. I stand corrected. Mr. Whitfield. And Exhibit 2, does it also mention Russia, France, and China? Mr. Smego. Yes. At the rates of Russia receiving 40 percent, France 15 percent, and China 11 percent of the approximately 80 million barrels. Mr. Whitfield. And then on Exhibit 3, does it specifically mention those countries as being a part of the permanent membership of the Security Council? Mr. Smego. Absolutely. Exhibit 3 is a disclosure of the oil allocations after the sixth phase. It is subtitled Special Orders. Mr. Whitfield. Now, they refer I believe in that exhibit also to standard oil--standard orders and specific orders or special orders. What's the difference in those two? Mr. Smego. Underneath special orders, the committee can see that certain entities and individuals are listed. They are nonstandard--they are not oil companies themselves. So one could certainly draw the conclusion that the standard orders were for the oil companies, whereas the special orders were for those entities that were not standard purchasers. Mr. Whitfield. Now, is my understanding correct that, under a special order, you can literally walk away from the contractual obligation? Mr. Smego. I would not be qualified to answer that. Mr. Whitfield. Okay. Now, I want to ask you a few questions about this Iraqi Intelligence Service documents. You mentioned that you translated I think nine of those; is that correct? Mr. Smego. Yes. Nine documents, sir. Mr. Whitfield. Does it appear from those documents that Saddam Hussein attempted to implement a strategy of improving relations with the French government? Mr. Smego. Certainly. By January 2002, under Exhibit 4, a memorandum from the Office of the Secretary of the President Abed Hamid al-Hattab, stated, and I quote: ``the present leader, God bless him, ordered the improvement of dealing with France.'' Mr. Whitfield. And did the IAS subsequently take steps to carry out that directive from Saddam Hussein? Mr. Smego. Yes, sir. The Exhibit 5 states, with the subject of Iraqi-French relations, to prepare an Iraqi delegation to France in exchange for an invitation of French delegations to Iraq. And that specifically, under point number 5, economic privilege such as oil and trade was to be given to French political and economic individuals close to the center of political decisionmaking. Mr. Whitfield. Okay. Mr. Smego. There was also allegations of support--or at least, I should say, number 7 specifies the study, the possibility to support one of the candidates in the French Presidential elections. Mr. Whitfield. Okay. Now, let me ask you. On exhibit 11--or I want to call your attention to that a minute. This document purports to show that the regime, the Saddam Hussein's regime subsequently refined their strategy on influencing French companies or delegations, et cetera. Could you discuss for us what that says? Mr. Smego. Absolutely, sir. By April 2002, point 2 approves the granting of contracts to the French companies which are the most important and influential in the French field. However, point 3 of the document refines it in saying that: Regarding the subject of doing business with the small French companies, it is understood that the small companies are not beneficial to the country. Meaning Iraq. Mr. Whitfield. So they focused on large French companies? Mr. Smego. Absolutely. The small companies apparently did not pan out for them. Mr. Whitfield. Now, did you find any documents during your work for the committee that identified specific individuals that the regime sought to target? Mr. Smego. Yes, sir. Examples 6 and 7 are the best-- Exhibits 6 and 7 are the best examples of such. Mr. Whitfield. Now, Exhibit 6, what does it say in Exhibit 6? Mr. Smego. The subject of the memorandum, it's dated in February 2002 from the assistant director of the Iraqi Intelligence Service to the director regarding Iraqi-French relations. They named 12 French individuals of influence, among them the former French president Valery Giscard d'Estaing, Charles Pasqua, Jean-Pierre Chevenement. Please forgive my pronunciation of French names. Jacques DeLors. And other individuals. Mr. Whitfield. Now, did you find any documents showing that any payments were made, for example, to Charles Pasqua? Mr. Smego. The documents that I have presented here today, I do not have anything that directly denotes a payment to Mr. Pasqua. However, there were several documents regarding--or that at least mentioned Mr. Pasqua in them. Among them, the first would be Exhibit 13. Mr. Whitfield. And according to the Duelfer Report, Mr. Pasqua received allocations for 11 million barrels of oil, of which 10.75 was actually lifted. But would you walk us through Exhibit 13? Mr. Smego. Certainly. Exhibit 13, the first bullet under which states that: First of all, the subject is the French individual or dignitary, Charles Pasqua, that Saddam Hussein personally approved designating 3 million barrels of oil to Charles Pasqua. And that the Frenchman Bernard Guyet, who represented Charles Pasqua also visited and requested the contract be under Genmar Company. It was a Swiss company. However, when the Iraqi side made it clear that it was necessary to choose a French company, apparently Mr. Bernard Guyet stated that it was not possible for political reasons. Mr. Whitfield. And was there any additional information on that page? Mr. Smego. Absolutely. When the Iraqi State Oil Marketing Organization requested from Mr. Guyet a letter of authorization from Mr. Charles Pasqua to Genmar for Genmar to lift the crude oil, Mr. Guyet refused and clarified that they could not provide that because of a fear of political scandal. Mr. Whitfield. Okay. Mr. Smego. Subsequently, a few days later, Exhibit 14, a letter from the office of the deputy prime minister reminds the SOMO executive director that Mr. Bernard Guyet is the diplomatic and political adviser for Mr. Pasqua, and he represents him to receive the oil allocation. Mr. Whitfield. Okay. Now, are you familiar with a company called Ibex Energy? Mr. Smego. Yes, sir, I am. Mr. Whitfield. During the course of your work, did you find any documents relating to Ibex? Mr. Smego. Yes, sir, I did. Mr. Whitfield. Is Ibex a French company? Mr. Smego. I would not be qualified to answer that. Mr. Whitfield. Okay. Mr. Smego. Exhibit 37, if you would, please. Now, the Iraqi document does specify that Ibex Energy is a French company, but I have not validated such. Mr. Whitfield. Okay. Mr. Smego. Exhibit 37 is a letter from the Iraqi vice president Taha Yassin Ramadan, who addressed the letter to the minister of oil approving the supply of Ibex with a quantity of 1.8 million--or, excuse me, 1.8 million barrels of oil to be included in phase 5 specifically ``as the beginning of doing business with this company as well as to know the potential of advantage from their activities in other fields.'' Mr. Whitfield. And then I notice on Exhibit 38 a payment of $19,700 was made to a Portuguese citizen named Armando Carlos for services rendered. Is that correct? Mr. Smego. Yes, that is correct, it did appear on Exhibit 38. Mr. Whitfield. And who is Mr. Carlos? Mr. Smego. Mr. Carlos is apparently an oil inspector as reviewed in Exhibit 39. Mr. Whitfield. And what does Exhibit 39 point out? Mr. Smego. Exhibit 39 is a letter from the minister of oil in April 2002 to the deputy prime minister stating that two additional quantities of oil had been loaded from the Min al Bakar terminal with the coordination of the oil inspector, the agreement with the oil inspector for his share of 2 percent of the profit of the additional quantity in exchange for his services. And point 3 specifically names that Armando Carlos has been paid $105,819 for both aforementioned shipments. Mr. Whitfield. Okay. I see my time has expired. So at this point, I would recognize Mr. Stupak for 10 minutes of questioning. Mr. Stupak. Mr. Smego, in your testimony you were requested to look for documents that referred to particular topics. Is that correct? Mr. Smego. That is correct, sir. Mr. Stupak. What were those topics? Mr. Smego. The majority counsel specified that we would be searching the oil documents for transactions that would be from entities or regarding individuals or entities from the United Nations permanent Security Council member nations that did not appear to have an established history in the oil trading industry. Mr. Stupak. So if an oil company would be an established entity that had traded in the oil world market, you wouldn't look at those? Mr. Smego. We generally went over the companies that did not have a specific influence or any signs of outside influence or use of oil for influence. Mr. Stupak. Well, did you look for things like Coastal Oil? Did you look for that entity. Mr. Smego. Coastal Oil did appear. Coastal Oil documents were very lightly referenced in those pages. Mr. Stupak. But they were referenced. Mr. Smego. But we do not have anything that was presented here today. Mr. Stupak. Why not? Mr. Smego. It was not the discretion--or, excuse me; it was at the discretion of the majority counsel. Mr. Stupak. What about Bay Oil? Mr. Smego. Again, that would be at the discretion of the majority counsel. Mr. Stupak. Did you see Bay Oil in there, though? Mr. Smego. I do not recall any specific documents. Mr. Whitfield. Mr. Stupak, I might just mention, in the binder there are some letters from Oscar Wyatt of Coastal that was translated by Mr. Smego. I just would point that out to you. It is Exhibits 40 and 41. Mr. Stupak. So the documents you looked at, you were really directed by the majority counsel to look at these documents and you didn't go much further than that? Mr. Smego. There were 21 DVDs containing 60,000 pages. We certainly had our hands full with the amount of pages, and to quickly triage or at least have gone through 23,000, we hit what we could. Mr. Stupak. Okay. I guess what I am trying to focus on, how did you focus your investigation; on what majority counsel told you, or were you trying to get at companies that dealt with Iraqi Oil-for-Food program that looked questionable? Mr. Smego. I brought documents to the attention of the majority counsel. It was upon his approval that documents would be translated and presented. Mr. Stupak. Okay. Besides looking at these documents as far as them being accurate, would you have any personal knowledge of them being accurate? Mr. Smego. Would you be saying authentic, or the translation? Mr. Stupak. Authentic. I am sure your translation is correct. The authenticity. Mr. Smego. I am not sure if I would be qualified to provide an answer, based that I have not inspected the original document itself. Mr. Stupak. Okay. Do you know whether the statements contained in these documents like Exhibit 4 and 5 and 11 and 6 and 7, do you know if they are true? Mr. Smego. I can simply state that the documents were written by, or at least from the perspective of the Iraqi side, whether the author of the Iraqi document put fact in there I am not aware. I cannot confirm the facts. I can simply tell you what the document states. Mr. Stupak. Should we assume, then, that only the people who wrote them and those who received them can really testify as to their truthfulness or accuracy? Mr. Smego. Well, I can simply tell you what the language states. Whether to be confirmed or not, no in-depth analysis was performed. Mr. Stupak. Okay. When you look at so many of these documents, some of these dates just seem to be off base. One date, and then it is a year later you see another date. Like, take document 2 and 3, the ones you pointed out here. Take a look at No. 2. The date on that document, if I am reading this right, is November 22, 1998. And then you look at document No.3 which you reference as part of it, and that is a year later. Mr. Smego. Yes, those dates are accurate. Mr. Stupak. So how do you tie these two into each other is, I guess, what I am trying to figure out. On Document 2 you say Russia gets 40 percent, France 50, and China 11. And then you go to document No.3 here and it is a whole year later. Mr. Smego. That is correct, sir. In November 1998 the decision was made to withhold a portion of the oil during that phase and split it as we have--the document states. Exhibit 3 shows that a year later, that the Iraqi State Oil Marketing Organization had put together a spreadsheet outlining No. 1, 2 and 3, being Russia, China and France, under the subheading of ``countries of permanent membership.'' Mr. Stupak. Okay. In this whole deal here, when you talk about individual profits, these individuals again, this, for Mr. Pasqua and all that, whether they received that money you have no idea; right? Mr. Smego. I do not have access, or I was not presented with any documents regarding that. I can simply have the documents from the State Oil Marketing Organization. Mr. Stupak. Okay. Dr. Gordon, if I can ask you this question. In your testimony you seem to put all the blame on the problems with the Oil-for-Food program on the Security Council and 661 sanctions committee. I call it the sanctions committee. Do you believe that the U.N. staff and the Office of Iraqi Programs were aggressive enough in identifying the problems and bringing them to the sanctions committee attention? Ms. Gordon. Yes. From everything I have seen I think that is quite true. If you look at what is called the customs officer within the OIP, they absolutely did find several dozen instances of clear price irregularities and all of those occasions brought them directly to the 661 committee. In the case of the oil overseers it was the same. They noted very quickly when the oil prices were not consistent with fair market value, immediately brought these to the attention of the 661 committee. That is correct. Mr. Stupak. Mr. Fawcett, do you agree with that? Mr. Fawcett. No, I don't. I think out of the 20,000 contracts for the U.N. officials, to find 70 that were a problem, I think they could have done that by the end of breakfast. The fact that these were---- Mr. Stupak. What would make a contract out of order, then, other than price? Mr. Fawcett. I think price, the fact that there was no competitive bidding, should have shown to anyone looking at this--to see a company from a country that is closely allied with Iraq would immediately raise the attention of an inspector or of a customs official. Also, the great majority of the goods going in were commodities. They were not difficult to price. It was not difficult to work out what was the standard world price for a commodity; therefore, what should the price actually be. Mr. Stupak. You said one of the things you look at is countries closely aligned with Iraq. But 75 percent of that oil ended up back here in the United States, and the United States really isn't closely aligned with Iraq. Mr. Fawcett. Correct. But we are talking about the contractor, the first contractor. The game with the oil purchases was to allow someone else to pay the kickbacks, not the major oil companies of the world, not the refiners. Clearly, the end user would know there is a problem, but they would not be the one paying the kickback themselves. Mr. Stupak. And everyone knew there were kickbacks going on. Mr. Fawcett. Absolute, without a doubt. Ms. Gordon. Mr. Stupak, I wonder if I might address this notion that only 70 of the 20,000. Mr. Stupak. Sure. Ms. Gordon. I understand Mr. Fawcett to be suggesting that they weren't working that hard to come up with that 70. I think what is important to understand is that the Iraqi Government was not stupid. If they had had extreme price irregularities and frequency, that would have been noted. What they did do was pad the contracts, for the most part, in fairly small amounts, 5 to 10 percent, where the result of padding was often in contracts that were made to order, that were built to specifications, for which there were not in fact standard oil prices. I think what we see is not a failure to discern extreme pricing irregularity, but in fact consistence in finding those. And no one is seeing the irregularities when they were marginal, 5 to 10 percent. I would also point out that by the history of what we have seen so far, there is no reason to think that the Security Council would have responded any differently if in fact OIP had presented more contracts with price irregularities. Mr. Stupak. Mr. Fawcett, let me ask you this. In your longer report, you stated that although the major oil companies stopped buying Iraqi crude from middlemen after Saddam imposed a surcharge, BP and Exxon began to buy again after just a couple of months and claimed they did not deal with companies that did pay surcharges. Do you think their claims should be investigated? And wasn't the surcharge just passed on to the end user, basically the American people? Mr. Fawcett. From all appearances, that is correct. Mr. Stupak. Do you think it should be investigated? Mr. Fawcett. I think someone should investigate, whether it's this committee or not. And if you do, I am glad to help. Mr. Stupak. Thank you. It looks like my time's expired Mr. Chairman. Mr. Whitfield. Thank you Mr. Stupak. At this time I will recognize the chairman of the committee, Mr. Barton, for 10 minutes. Chairman Barton. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I have got some general questions. Then I am going to have some specific questions about the documents that are before the subcommittee this afternoon. My first general question is to Mr. Fawcett. Do you have any estimation of how many billions of dollars were skimmed from the Oil-for-Food program? Mr. Fawcett. I think the estimates have continually risen. In 2002 we estimated it was about 2.1 or 2.2 billion. However, we have not looked at the humanitarian supply side. So clearly it is higher. I think the latest is up to 4, 4.5. And whether that is the end or not, I doubt it. The one thing I've seen about this program is it's always worse than you think. Chairman Barton. Well, let me ask you a question. Regardless of how many billions were taken off the top, how much of that money, say we got a--if it could be proven that one of these officials got a personal voucher--and the one that is referenced in one of the documents is this Mr. Pasqua--be allocated 3 million barrels, well at $15 a barrel, that is $45 million. At $20 a barrel that's $60 million. If we could locate those funds, could they be recovered and remitted to the current Iraqi Government? Mr. Fawcett. Well, the vast majority of that money actually went to the U.N. Account. We are only looking, on the kickback you're looking at maybe 50 cents a barrel, maybe less. So the type of money there would be $1 million, $1.5 million. However---- Chairman Barton. So the fact that he got the voucher, he didn't get the total proceeds. Mr. Fawcett. No, not at all. Chairman Barton. Even if we could prove it, nobody alleges that he got the full value of those 3 million times whatever. Mr. Fawcett. Not at all. Chairman Barton. He got some sort of a commission. Mr. Fawcett. That's correct. However, to address your point of the bigger picture of recouping Iraqi assets, let's not forget that over history and over time, over the last three decades, Saddam has ripped off tens of billions of dollars, long beyond the Oil-for-Food. The highest estimate we have heard is $140 billion. The Oil-for-Food program is really only the latest, and that is what makes it important because it provides a window into Saddam's manipulation over the last 30 years. And the most recent information that we have, and this is why I think these investigations are very important, is they might lead us toward the money that he stole over time. Chairman Barton. Well that's my point. You made it better than I could through questioning. That at some point in time, all the investigations by all the various committees, various international bodies, not just the U.S. Congress, hopefully will result in an identification of recoverable assets. Mr. Fawcett. Absolutely. And that's--again, the Oil-for- Food is important because it is more recent. The old rip-offs have now been turned into investments, into real estate, into stocks, into bonds, into things that wealthy individuals invest in, much more difficult to find. But if we see in the Oil-for- Food, we find the same mechanisms, the same people involved that helped Saddam launder his money back in the seventies and eighties, so instead of separating this out and saying, well, he only ripped off this amount in the Oil-for-Food and he smuggled this amount, actually the stories should be merged in order to do the best for finding the ripped-off assets and returning them to the Iraqi people. Chairman Barton. Well, step one is to identify the theft. Step two is to recover the goods if we can identify where the stolen goods were. And unfortunately, and it is frustrating and I think members on both sides of the aisle share the frustration. We are still in step one. I'd rather be in step three, going after the goods and trying to get them back to the Iraqi people. I want to ask Mr. Smego a question. The documents that you reviewed for this committee and that you have translated, is there any reputable authority that disputes your translation? Mr. Smego. I would encourage that if there is any doubt about a personal--or a certain section of the translation, by all means you can certainly seek a second opinion. Chairman Barton. No. I am just saying since you have done the translations and they have been available, at least for review by staffs and I would assume others in official capacities, is there anybody out there that says you mistranslated them? Or can we stipulate that your translation is the correct translation? Mr. Smego. There is no indication to me, no one has approached me to say that these translations aren't correct. Chairman Barton. As far as this subcommittee is concerned, your translation can be considered to be a correct translation. Mr. Smego. That's correct. If another linguist were to translate the context or the substance, the message would not change. Chairman Barton. I know, Dr. Gordon, you are not a translation expert, but do you have any reason to doubt the veracity of the translations? Ms. Gordon. No, sir. I don't speak Arabic. Chairman Barton. Okay. Well, I just wanted to try to assert that our translations are the correct translation. Mr. Smego. One thing that I can suggest, sir, that with the assistance of the native Iraqi linguist, when you pair a native Iraqi speaker and a native English speaker and having actually two linguists work on the document, you produce a far superior translation than any one individual could produce. Chairman Barton. Okay. On document No. 5 in our binder, what--when we talk about the implications of this document, could you enlighten us a little bit on the implication of this document No. 5 that the present leader, Saddam Hussein--God bless him and protect him--has ordered the improvement of dealing with France, and then Iraq is going to send official political and social delegations to France; they are going to organize a roundtable in Baghdad and Paris to develop the relationship between both countries. The Foreign Minister is going to visit Paris, and tasking the International Council and Office of Foreign Relations of the party to approach the most influential parties in France and the French Parliament? And then item No. 5 on the second page of this document, do not consider granting economic privilege, oil and trade, to those who are not effective or do not have leverage. However, these privileges will be given to French political and economic individuals close to the center of the political decisionmaking. What does that imply, this document taken as a whole, in your opinion? Mr. Smego. Well, while I cannot specify as to what it implies, I can reassure you that these are recommendations from the assistant director of the Iraqi Intelligence Service, made to his boss, the director of the Iraqi Intelligence Service, on how possibly relations could be improved. Of note would be the director's margin note that is listed under the first margin note. The director questioned, how do we begin? Where do we go with this? He is basically questioning how to implement this plan and who the targets would be to influence. This memorandum followed subsequently Exhibit---- Chairman Barton. Well, if I wanted to imply--having read the documents, if I wanted to imply that this would be considered an official document of Saddam Hussein's regime, that they wanted to find out the people that counted in France and try to bribe them, would that be a wrong implication? I'm not saying it's a fact, but if I were to read this document, do not consider granting economic privilege to those who are not effective or do not have any leverage, the fact that it says granting economic privilege would indicate to me that at least somebody was thinking about bribing somebody in the French Government if they thought they had leverage. Would I be wrong to imply that? Mr. Smego. I wouldn't be qualified to judge that. Chairman Barton. Mr. Fawcett, would I be wrong to imply that? Mr. Fawcett. Well, without having seen the document it's hard for me to say. However, there is a lot of other corroborating evidence to show that that was---- Chairman Barton. And I'm not saying it's a fact. I'm just saying a person of normal intelligence, if we assume that these documents are correctly translated--and nobody apparently is asserting that the gentleman to your left has improperly translated them--if you just read the language and the plain meaning of it, it would imply to me that Saddam Hussein was thinking about bribing people in France if they were in a position of power. That is my implication. Mr. Fawcett. They also publicly went on the record long ago, back in the late nineties, saying that they were going to skew the contracts toward those political supporters internationally. So this is not strange at all. This fits exactly in with their policy. Chairman Barton. Well, my time is about to expire. My last question on this document 13, where the French dignitary Charles Pasqua says the present leader, Saddam Hussein, God bless him, approved designating 3 million barrels to him, the French dignitary. Why in the world would the Iraqi Government give Mr. Pasqua the concession for 3 million barrels? He's not an oil trader, that I am aware of. I mean, Mr. Stupak has pointed that out. So why would they do that? Why didn't they pick Congressman Joe Barton, or you, or the good professor to your left? Why did they pick him? Mr. Smego. Is that question directed to me, sir? Chairman Barton. It is a question, yeah. Just out of the blue, why did he get picked? Did he have any ability to influence things in the French Government or maybe be an influence maker himself? If I were trying to influence the French Government, might I pick him? Mr. Smego. One might go back to Exhibits 6 and 7, No.2 of Exhibit 6, subparagraph (b). The French Charles Pasqua was the former Minister of the Interior and the French candidate for Presidential elections in the current period. And it references that it would be possible to approach Mr. Pasqua through the relationship of Tarik Aziz. Chairman Barton. So he might be able to influence the French decision on these sanctions, the position the French Government might take in the U.N. regarding these sanctions and regarding lifting the sanctions, mightn't he? Mr. Smego. That is what Exhibit 6 might mean. Chairman Barton. It might be money well spent if you were Saddam Hussein. Might be. I think it would be. If I decided I wanted to bribe somebody in France, he'd be a good target. Mr. Chairman, I yield back my time. Mr. Whitfield. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Waxman is recognized for 10 minutes. Mr. Waxman. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. It seems that what we have here is a story of smuggling going on, even though there was an embargo and kickbacks, in the sale of oil, the proceeds of which were supposed to provide food for the Iraqi people. Mr. Fawcett, is that what we are looking at? Mr. Fawcett. Yes, that's right. Mr. Waxman. Okay. And the kickbacks, from what we know from these documents and otherwise, were to whom? To countries, to individuals, to oil companies? Mr. Fawcett. The kickbacks were sent back to bank accounts in Jordan largely. And the accounts were, depending on the humanitarian side, the accounts were registered to the relevant ministry. And my understanding of the mechanism, that the signators from that ministry, as soon as the money was received, sent it on to another bank account of which they didn't know much about, implying that it was going to either Saddam's family or to the Iraqi intelligence. Mr. Waxman. I see. Dr. Gordon, was the U.N. supposed to be monitoring this whole program to provide some kind of transparency? Ms. Gordon. The whole program meaning the Oil-for-Food program? Mr. Waxman. The Oil-for-Food program. Ms. Gordon. Again, I think you have to start by not speaking of the U.N. as a whole. I think that it is easy to not see how things function if you only look at, quote, the U.N. What is really important is to look at what were the obligations and responsibilities of the Secretariat, which included the OIP, the Office of Iraq Programs, and what were the responsibilities and obligations of the Security Council. Obviously both are within the United Nations, but as we talk these days about whether Kofi Annan should step down or what the failures were on the part of Secretariat or whether the U.N. as a whole needs to be reformed, what is really crucial is to say who exactly made what decisions, when. Who exactly had what oversight responsibilities? Mr. Waxman. What was the committee, the 661? Ms. Gordon. It was a committee of the Security Council that mirrored the Council. There were 15 members, one from each member state of the Security Council. It operated by consensus, so any member of 661 committee could veto any matter at any point for any reason. Mr. Waxman. And so they were supposed to oversee the program. Ms. Gordon. That's correct. Mr. Waxman. And the U.S. was part of that? Ms. Gordon. Yes, of course. Mr. Waxman. And this committee signed off on all the deals? Ms. Gordon. That's correct. More than signed off. Had full knowledge at every point. That was what the U.N. staff of the Secretariat did, and did very well. They provided information. They provided advising. If I could identify one particular decision of the Security Council, as the Congressman before was looking at Mr. Smego's documents--and we have heard a great deal about the vouchers that went to Russians, the vouchers that went to French officials, and it is as though this is new information or somehow surprising that Saddam Hussein would use oil sales to garner political leverage. In fact, that was an explicit decision on the part of the Security Council when it passed Security Council Resolution 986 on the memorandum of understanding, which is, it was an explicit decision to give Iraq the right to choose its trade partners both for import contracts and for oil sales. It was understood at that time that Iraq was likely to use that to get--for political leverage. As we see, the memo consisted of vouchers and secret vouchers. In fact, as far as I can see, those vouchers are nothing other than the bookkeeping device by which the Iraqi Government exercised the right that the Security Council gave it to choose its trade partners. Mr. Waxman. Would the U.S. have known about this? Ms. Gordon. Of course. Mr. Waxman. And so the U.S. Government, as part of the Security Council committee 661, was aware that they were giving Saddam Hussein the power to do the kinds of things he had done in the past: provide corruption and kickbacks and such. Ms. Gordon. Of course. I mean---- Mr. Waxman. Let me just settle with that, of course, because I wanted to pursue another matter with Mr. Smego, and maybe someone else will follow up on this. Mr. Smego, the committee asked you to review several documents from SOMO, the Iraqi State Oil Marketing Organization. And I'd like to ask you to review another SOMO document which was handed to you by my staff, if I may. First, could you please verify for the committee that this document is on or purports to be on SOMO letterhead and is signed by the General Manager of SOMO, Mohammad al Jabari? Mr. Smego. No, I cannot. Mr. Waxman. You cannot. In looking at it, does it appear to be on SOMO letterhead? Mr. Smego. I have never seen such letterhead. Mr. Waxman. Okay. Have you ever seen SOMO letterhead? Mr. Smego. Yes, I have. Mr. Waxman. And this is different letterhead than SOMO company letterhead? Mr. Smego. It is different from all of the other SOMO letterhead that I have seen. Mr. Waxman. It is different. Okay. Could you look at the highlighted text of this letter and verify that it says, SOMO purchased gasoline to import into Iraq for approximately $1 per gallon. I believe the text reads quote, ``U.S.D. 347 per metric ton delivered to Baghdad, which is about $0.98 per gallon,'' end quote. Mr. Smego. I can verify that it is not in Arabic nor that I have translated the document. It is the first time that I have ever seen it. Mr. Waxman. But you can verify that's what it says on this piece of paper. Mr. Smego. In English, I see that; yes, sir. Mr. Waxman. Okay. So SOMO, according to this document, was importing gasoline into Iraq for less than $1 per gallon. And, Mr. Chairman, I am going to ask that this letter be made part of the hearing record. Mr. Whitfield. I would ask the gentleman where did this letter come from? Mr. Waxman. Well, let me withdraw my request because I don't want to use up my time for questions. Ms. Gordon, let me turn to you. Suppose a French company had a separate contract to bring gasoline into Iraq, that this French company was being paid out of Oil-for-Food funds and that that French company charged not $1 per gallon but more than $2.50 per gallon. Would you agree that someone at least ought to examine that discrepancy and figure out why a French company was allowed to charge 250 percent higher than normal Iraqi price? Ms. Gordon. I'm sorry. A French company to import---- Mr. Waxman. If we found out a French company was charging 250 percent higher than normal Iraqi price, wouldn't that discrepancy call out for some examination? Ms. Gordon. I suppose so. Mr. Waxman. If I also told you this French company got this contract in secret and that no other companies were allowed to bid on it, wouldn't that be a factor for someone to look into? Wouldn't that raise suspicion? Ms. Gordon. I would expect so. Mr. Waxman . Well, Mr. Chairman, this is not a hypothetical example I invented. This is a real case. But it didn't happen under the Oil-for-Food program. It happened under the Development Fund for Iraq under the Bush administration. And it wasn't a French company, it was an American company; it was Halliburton. The administration gave Halliburton its contract in secret, in a no-bid process. It excluded all other companies. The Pentagon's own auditors have now determined that Halliburton overcharged by more than $212 million under this contract. And even though the administration paid Halliburton with Iraqi funds from the DFI, it intentionally concealed these overcharges from the United Nations. My point is not to detract from the Oil-for-Food investigation, but to demonstrate that if these actions had been committed by a French company or by the French Government under the Oil-for-Food program, we undoubtedly would have had dozens of hearings by now. But presumably because it is Halliburton and the Bush administration, we have had none. This hampers the legitimacy of all our efforts, and I hope the committee will remedy that disparity very soon. Dr. Gordon, how would you compare the transparency of the American handling of the Iraqi oil funds with the transparency of the U.N. handling or the Security Council handling the Iraqi oil funds? Ms. Gordon. Well, as I said earlier, there are seven levels of oversight just for import contracts, and another set of separate controls for oil sales. What is the case is that with the Oil-for-Food program, to the extent that there were improprieties, they happened not because of an absence of oversight or accountability, but, in fact as large as these numbers sound to us, they happened at a marginal level. They happened around the edges. They happened on isolated occasions and they happened despite an elaborate, consistently implemented system of oversight at least on the part of U.N. personnel. By contrast, if you look at Security Council Resolution 1483, which is the resolution that recognized that the occupation authority systematically eliminates all of the forms of oversight that were in place under the Oil-for-Food program, it replaces them with certain other forms of transparency in some cases, and some forms of oversight are not replaced at all. And as I believe you mentioned earlier, we have already seen a huge spate of reports coming out from the inspector general of the CPA itself, from the Defense Contract Auditing Agency, and from KPMG Bahrain, which is the auditor retained by the International Advisory Monitoring Board, all of which indicate a level of corruption and mismanagement that quite frankly dwarfs the most extreme of the accusations against the Oil-for-Food program. Mr. Waxman. Thank you. Mr. Chairman, I want to renew my request to put the letter in. And you asked where I obtained the letter. The letter was---- Chairman Barton. Mr. Chairman, I object. Mr. Waxman. I thought the chairman of the full committee indicated that we work on a bipartisan basis and take documents---- Chairman Barton. I will do that. But I am objecting to this request because it has not been done on a bipartisan basis. Mr. Waxman. Well, we did furnish it to the majority staff. And if I might further tell you about this document, this was sent to the staff. Chairman Barton. You can tell me about it off the record. But I am going to object and I want to make a statement as soon as your time has expired. Mr. Waxman. Well, if you want to make a statement, then I want to make a statement; because I don't know what you are going to say, but it sounds to me like a pretty negative one about even trying to find out that SOMO has indicated to us through a document they sent to us, that they were angry about Halliburton getting so much more money than they were in providing gasoline to Iraq. Chairman Barton. Mr. Chairman, I think the gentleman's time has expired. Mr. Whitfield. I might also just add that on this document, in and of itself, I see no mention of Halliburton in here at all. I mean the name Halliburton does not appear anywhere in this document. And I guess because the chairman has objected, so---- Mr. Waxman. Well, Mr. Chairman, the other audits we provided DCAA, the auditor for the Pentagon, has indicated that Halliburton was paid from Iraq funds run by the U.S. administration in Iraq, and they also indicated that there may be as much as $200 million that have been overpaid in excess of what the gasoline would have charged. Mr. Whitfield. The other reports have been entered into the record in their entirety and not by excerpt. But the gentleman's time has expired. And at this point I would call on the gentleman from Texas. Mr. Waxman. Point of order, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Whitfield. Yes. Mr. Waxman. The gentleman from Texas has had his time for questioning. If he is going to be recognized, and I certainly don't object to it---- Mr. Whitfield. No, I was getting ready to recognize---- Mr. Waxman. If he is going make a statement that pertains to anything that I have asked about, are you going to out of order allow me to---- Chairman Barton. Parliamentary inquiry, Mr. Chairman. Does the Chair have the right of recognition? Mr. Whitfield. Yes. Chairman Barton. Has the Chair recognized the gentleman from Texas? Mr. Waxman. I asked a point of order, which is a higher form of parliamentary inquiry. Mr. Whitfield. Just a minute. I was getting ready to recognize Dr. Burgess of Texas for his question-and-answer period. So does anyone object? If not, I am going to call on Dr. Burgess for his 10 minutes. Chairman Barton. Well, Mr. Chairman I thought you had recognized me. Did you not recognize me? Mr. Whitfield. I was recognizing the gentleman from Texas for his questions. But I would be happy to recognize the chairman of the committee. Chairman Barton. Okay. And I will yield to Mr. Waxman. But I have a statement that I want to make and then I will be happy to yield to the gentleman from California. Mr. Whitfield. Okay. Chairman Barton. We have operated this subcommittee, as far as I know, for the last 20 years under both Democrat and Republican, in a bipartisan fashion when it came to document presentation. Now, I am told that the documents in the binder have been shared with the minority staff for at least a month. If that is in error, I need to be told that. The documents the gentleman from California has twice tried to get into the record have not been shared with anybody until they showed up at this hearing. Now, if the gentleman from California has documents that he wishes to be put into the record, if he would share them with the majority staff in an appropriate fashion, in all likelihood they would be entered into the record. But showing up at a hearing and having these surprise documents asked to be put into the record by unanimous consent is not going to be tolerated. If you have got documents, share them with the majority staff and we will work it out and we will put them in the record. That is what I am objecting to. I am not objecting that you have a document. And if it is a legitimate document, and is a part of the hearing record it will be put in. But this is the second time, Mr. Waxman, in one hearing that you have presented documents to go into the record that I am told we have not seen until hearing. That is what I am objecting to, and I will be happy to yield to my friend from California. Mr. Waxman. Well, Mr. Chairman, I have no knowledge when you provided our staff with this binder, but we are told it was last Thursday. But that is not the point for me. We, as part of the investigation on the Government Reform Committee, received the documents from SOMO--which is of two pages--before this hearing was ever called. The other documents---- Chairman Barton. Reclaiming my time. When did you share it with the majority staff? Mr. Waxman. Well, when we walked into the hearing. Chairman Barton. Today? Mr. Waxman. Yes. Chairman Barton. Today. And how long have you had it? Mr. Waxman. Well, let me finish what I am saying to you, because I think you are misreading what we are doing here. I had some questions about the other documents that I put into the record which are already out, and I am sure each of these witnesses has heard about them. And that is the Special Inspector General Stuart Bowen's report of maybe $9 billion having been lost from the Iraq funds since the U.S. took over the Oil-for-Food funds. This is not a surprise I have pulled on the committee. These are documents that have been well reported in the press. And maybe if the chairman would permit---- Chairman Barton. Well, reclaiming my time. Mr. Waxman. Let me finish my thought. Chairman Barton. I have the time. I have yielded to you because I believe in a full and fair debate. Mr. Waxman. And you have cut me at least two times. Chairman Barton. But it's my time. Mr. Waxman. You've cut me off two times. Chairman Barton. It's my time. Now, you have been a valued member of the full subcommittee since before I was even in the Congress, I think. Now I don't know how long you've been on the subcommittee, but you have been on the subcommittee a long time. You were a former subcommittee chairman of this committee when your party was in the majority. You, more than anybody, know that to have these investigations and these hearings, documents and materials need to be shared. You, more than anybody, should know that you don't walk into a hearing the day of the hearing, if you're trying to be cooperative, and spring documents. Now, if they are legitimate documents, they deserve to be a part of the record. My objection is not whether these documents are good, bad. My objection is that twice in one hearing, a senior member of the minority, who's a former subcommittee chairman when you were in the majority, has tried to put documents in the record without vetting them through the normal process. That's my objection. If you're willing to stipulate that you'll use the normal procedure with the minority staff and Mr. Stupak and his staff on this subcommittee, we won't have a problem. Mr. Waxman. Will the gentleman yield to me? Chairman Barton. I'll be happy to yield. Mr. Waxman. I want to point out the essential point that I made in the very beginning. This is the 13th hearing on the Oil-for-Food program from Iraq. And I am critical of the fact that we have had zero hearings on the U.S. use of the Iraqi oil funds. And therefore, I have raised the issue because it is an investigation that I and my staff have been pursuing without any cooperation from this committee. Now, I appreciate your berating me on an issue of whether I shared these documents in time, which are already in public record. But I am going to berate you because I think the Republican leadership should be looking into both issues, the Oil-for-Food mismanagement and the mismanagement by the U.S. Government of billions of dollars, $9 of which have been lost or laundered or absconded with under the direct jurisdiction of the U.S. Government. So I hope you would take it into your thought process that perhaps we ought to expand our investigation, and I'd be happy to work with you on that. Chairman Barton. Well, reclaiming my time. I am not aware of one instance the gentleman from California has come up to me and asked for my help or cooperation in anything you just said. Mr. Waxman. Well, consider yourself asked. Chairman Barton. Maybe you have and I've just got a bad memory, which is quite possible. But I don't recall it. Now, are you---- Mr. Waxman. I recall that we have had another hearing of this committee on this issue, and at that time I raised the concern that we were looking at the Oil-for-Food program and not paying any attention to the U.S. administration of the Iraq oil funds. That was on the record and we can get the transcript for it. You maybe didn't pay attention to it because I am only a Democratic member of the committee. That may be true. But I think it's worth investigating. Chairman Barton. Reclaiming my time, this member of the majority is the person who, on the House floor during the energy bill, asked unanimous consent that you could offer your amendment, when you weren't on the floor to offer it. That is who this member is. That is who this member is who has tried to go above and beyond to make sure that regardless of the majority or minority, if you're a member of this committee, all your rights are adhered to. The gentleman well knows that. Mr. Waxman. And I appreciate that and thank the gentleman for it. But this is not a personal matter. This is a matter of public concern, and if we are going to look at the kickbacks and corruption and use of funds that should be directed to helping the Iraqi people, I think we are not only looking at one side of it, perhaps for political purposes, justifiably so, because I think it is worth pursuing, but we also ought to look at the $9 billion that have been lost or unaccounted for when the U.S. Government was in charge directly, and the failure of the U.S. Government to handle in a transparent manner, or even provide the U.N. the information about what was happening there when we were operating pursuant to a U.N. resolution. I thank the gentleman for allowing the further discussion of this matter. And if you still object for my document which I questioned the witness to be in the record, I will accept that fact. But the gentleman did have it before him and we will make it available to anyone. Chairman Barton. I just want the documents vetted by the majority staff. And if the staff says they are acceptable, I am not opposed at some point in time to them being in the record. But I do strenuously object to the process, and if we don't get agreement on the process, then there will be an objection every time on process. Mr. Stupak. Mr. Chairman, if I may. Mr. Whitfield. Yes, Mr. Stupak. Mr. Stupak. Mr. Chairman, if I may, I would request that, No. 1, we give Mr. Waxman some time to lay a foundation on where this document came from. If it's part of a public record, I don't know why it would not be admitted into the record. And I would ask that we give him 3 days or so to at least be allowed to submit this for the record, provided a foundation can be established. Mr. Whitfield. Well, I would ask that he vet it through our staff. And then I would also just like to reiterate what Chairman Barton said; and that is we do--have had a policy of sharing documents, maybe not months in advance, but I know that this binder on the Oil-for-Food program was provided 6, 7 days ago. And I do think that it is not fair to bring documents up here that day, that we have never seen, and start testifying from them. And particularly in this document, there is nothing on this document whatsoever relating to Halliburton. Halliburton is not in any way referenced. But at your request, I think that we will get the document and work with the staff and make some decision. But at this point, an objection has been made to admitting it into the record. Mr. Waxman. Mr. Chairman, might I just point out that we are talking about two pages? You have a binder of many other documents. I wonder what happens next. Are we supposed to submit our intended questions of the witnesses to the Republican staff as well, to see if those are going to be permitted to be asked? Because it seems to me that that is the direction in which this committee is going. And I certainly hope that is not the case. Mr. Whitfield. I don't think that's necessary. Mr. Waxman. But I had asked about it, this document. I would be pleased to write a letter to the chairman and he can include it in the record or not. But this is a document that we received from the State Oil Marketing Organization that works for the Iraqis in dealing with their oil, and they were getting paid a lot less than what we were paying Halliburton to bring in gasoline into Iraq at the same time, and that ought to be investigated. I wish the committee would investigate that as well. Mr. Whitfield. Okay. Mr. Waxman, thanks for your comments. Now, I want to call on the gentleman from Texas, Dr. Burgess, for his 10 minutes of questions. Mr. Burgess. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Dr. Gordon, in reading through your testimony on paragraph 1, the effectiveness of the program, you write, ``I think it is important to begin by recognizing that the Oil-for-Food program and the U.N. staff involved were in fact tremendously successful at raising the quality of life for the Iraqi population.'' I'm sorry, I just find that an incredible statement to make. I'm astonished by that. But you back it up with measurement and I guess what I would like to ask, if I could, is that you will provide us some documentation for the statements that then follow. Is this something that you have personal knowledge of, something that has been provided to you by the U.N. or UNICEF? Because it just doesn't square at all with what I saw myself when I was in the country of Iraq in August. You said the health care system was much better able to meet its population's needs. I was in Al Majar Hospital in August 2003. That place was physically decrepit. There was no reliable running water. The sewer system was just open into the courtyard . Flies were everywhere. The doctors complained that the medicine they had under Saddam were worthless, and, in fact, they'd have suffered greatly if Kuwait hadn't started a massive humanitarian influx of medication to the country of Iraq shortly after Saddam fell. I was in their NICU. There wasn't any piped-in medical gas nor was there any provision for any medical gas. There was an infant there, clearly a premature infant, probably small for gestational age as well, who clearly had what I would characterize as rather significant respiratory distress syndrome and had no oxygen on. I suspect that that child was probably dead before nightfall. I'm sorry, but I don't see that that is a good system that was brought to the people of Iraq under the Oil-for-Food program. And mind you, at the same time the palaces that we went into, granted there was some damage from the combat phase, but the palaces that we went into were absolutely spectacular, with marble overlays on everything, marble floors, certainly comparable to anything we have here in the United States Capitol. So can I ask you to just discuss that statement a little bit? Ms. Gordon. Well, sir, I would be happy to do you the dubious favor of giving you more than you would ever want to read on this. You could start, if you want to, by going to the Web site for the Office of Iraq Program. And you can at that spot download reports, more reports than I promise you will want to read by UNICEF---- Mr. Burgess. Well, reclaiming my time, because I do have several things I want to get to. It certainly doesn't square with what I saw on the ground, and I'll believe my eyes before I'll believe a U.N. Report. Mr. Fawcett---- Ms. Gordon. Sir, I wonder if I could answer your question with 1 minute, which is to say what happened between 1996 and 2003 was that the situation, which was far far worse prior, was significantly improved. Remember, there had been a collapse from 90 to 96. From 96 to 2003 the level of food, nutrition, nearly doubled. The level of improvements in the health care system from 96 increased significantly. Electricity availability increased significantly. Availability of potable water increased significantly. I'm not saying it's a good system. I'm not claiming that at all. I am saying, by every measurement of every humanitarian agency there, between 96 and 2004, under the Oil-for-Food program, there were substantial improvements in the quality of life. Mr. Burgess. Reclaiming my time, probably those are Saddam's statistics. But I'll just tell you, what I saw in the palaces was a significant investment of capital. And if one- tenth of that capital had been put into those hospitals, those children wouldn't be suffering. Mr. Fawcett, I'd like to ask you for your response to that. Mr. Fawcett. All of the statistics upon which these judgments are made are Iraqi Government statistics. The U.N. reports in the late- or the mid-1990's that were used to raise the public awareness of all the children dying and build the fear of the Security Council that allowed that, forced them to give in to Saddam on these, were later proved to be false. These U.N. reports were retracted because they were based upon phony Iraqi Government statistics. That continued up till the time Saddam left. Mr. Burgess. Well, Mr. Fawcett, when you were giving your testimony, you ran out of time. And I believe you made the statement that you would like to talk about what the U.N. could have done, and perhaps you could take a minute and just tell us that. Mr. Fawcett. I think the first thing they could have done was not to circulate bad standards, circulate the Iraqi Government statistics aggressively, using them in a PR campaign to ease sanctions. They knew the statistics were bad. Maybe they couldn't do anything about that, about the gathering of the statistics. But they did not have to actively disseminate them, knowing they were false. So that is No. 1. Second, the whole program should have had transparency. There was none. There's a lot of documents that were published, virtually all of them are useless if you're trying to look into who's making money here and how are they making it. It's--the U.N. is great at putting out reports. But there's no detail in that report. There's no company names. There's no pricing of the commodities, things that the U.N. could have published anytime they wished. They did not need Security Council approval to do so. They could have been very transparent. In fact, when the Security Council was obstructive to the United Nations, as they were, as I absolutely agree they were, the U.N. could have gotten around that by just publishing documents and saying this is wrong. This is wrong. They failed to do so. They kept saying this is proprietary information, when this was a humanitarian program in a country under sanctions. The normal business rules should not have applied as far as keeping data secret. They could have published documents at any time. And had they done so, they would not be in the bind they are now. All the allegations of corruption against the Secretary General would have been dealt with long ago. Mr. Burgess. I guess I do find it odd that the costs for baby formula could be inflated by 25 percent in an organization that has as its mission disseminating that product around the world. I mean, how do you miss a 25 percent overcharge for Similac? Mr. Fawcett. That one puts me through the roof. It absolutely does. Mr. Burgess. Well, let me just ask you a question that I know is on the minds of my folks back home. Did the Secretary General have no decisionmaking role in setting the terms of this program? Mr. Fawcett. I'm sorry. I didn't understand. Mr. Burgess. Did the Secretary of the United Nations have no role in setting the parameters for this program? Mr. Fawcett. The current Secretary General was the first one to begin negotiations. The Iraqis actually liked him. He was replaced in 92 with another series of people that took a little bit harder line, and the Iraqis didn't like them. The Secretary General at the time that the program came into play was clearly a friend of the Iraqis, and that is another of the problems that we have seen early in the program. They should have gone to a far more competitive bidding process for the monitors and the banking. And now as we see from the Volcker Commission, it was the Secretary General himself that was manipulating the system. Mr. Burgess. Well, can you estimate the percentage of the kickbacks that might have been prevented had more thorough price checking been performed? Mr. Fawcett. I think at least half; without too much problem, half of the kickbacks could have been prevented. And I base that upon the fact that most of the goods going in are commodities. We know that some of the most difficult ones, gas- fired turbines from China, would be difficult to determine the price. Absolutely. But wheat from Australia, baby formula, milk, medicines from Pakistan or Switzerland, that's easy to do. Mr. Burgess. Well, besides just the dollars, were there any other warning signs that Saddam was charging kickbacks on the goods or contracts under the program? Mr. Fawcett. Shady operations. Companies with no backing, no background. While it's correct to say that it's the member states that put those companies forward, the U.N. Could have at any time said this one looks shady to us. But instead, they found themselves dealing with money launderers, with organized crime, and with terrorists. Mr. Burgess. And as my time is about expire, any other issues that the United Nations might have taken up to prevent this from going as far as it did? Mr. Fawcett. Courage, which they failed at. Mr. Burgess. Mr. Chairman, I'll yield back. Mr. Whitfield. Thank you, Dr. Burgess. At this time I will recognize Ms. Blackburn for 10 minutes. Mrs. Blackburn. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Dr. Gordon, I think I'd like to come to you first. I want to--you've talked a lot about the Oil-for-Food program and the comments and the responses that you have made. And so the question I would like to ask you is if you feel like, if I am understanding you right on this, do you feel like--do you think--is it your opinion that the Oil-for-Food program was adequately run, adequately and properly managed and given appropriate oversight? And if so, would you recommend that the United States participate in such programs in the future? Ms. Gordon. Again, I need to break it into which parts of the U.N. had responsibilities. Mrs. Blackburn. Go ahead. Very quickly. Ms. Gordon. So specifically the decision to allow Iraq to choose its trade partners. It was understood at the time that that would give Iraq considerable political leverage. If the Security Council members had not wanted to do that, it would have been easy enough to design the program without that. If you go to the other side of the fence, as it were, the U.N. staff, whose only responsibility under the Secretary General was to monitor, to provide information, to advise the 661 committee, not to make substantive decisions and not to design the program itself, by every account I've seen they did their job and they did their job well. The program was not designed or created by the Secretary General. It was created pursuant to Chapter 7 of the charter, which puts it directly under the control of the Security Council. Mrs. Blackburn. Okay. So I'm going to interrupt here. In other words, what you're telling me, then, is with the monitoring and the advice mechanisms, it is your opinion that it was adequately run and adequately and properly managed. Ms. Gordon. I would say the flaws that we have identified have to do with---- Mrs. Blackburn. Okay. And would it be your advice that we embark on such programs in the future? Ms. Gordon. Well, I think comprehensive sanctions on any country are destructive. Mrs. Blackburn. All right. Okay. What do you know of the Iraq steering committee and its administration of the Oil-for- Food program? Ms. Gordon. By the Iraq steering committee you mean the 661 committee? I am fairly familiar with how the 661 committee operates. Mrs. Blackburn. Do you think we ought to bring them before Congress? Do you think we should bring them before this committee to answer questions? Ms. Gordon. My understanding is that so far the State Department has declined to provide any of its participants on the 661 committee. Mrs. Blackburn. Okay. Let me ask you something else then. Do you think that there should be independent storage facilities to store U.N. documents in order to investigate further occurrences? Or, as we heard today, getting in behind this one might help lead us to others and other abuses and things. So do you think we need to set aside a facility to hold all of these documents? Ms. Gordon. I have no opinion on the mechanics of where you want to store documents. Mrs. Blackburn. All right, thank you. You know--and I appreciate your answers to my questions. I will have to tell you in my district in Tennessee, if you want to talk about something that gets the dander up of a lot of my constituents, it is talking about the waste, the fraud, the deceit, the despicable acts that took place with the formula program. That is, those are all things that really cause people to be incredibly, incredibly upset. And I appreciate your answering our questions. Mr. Fawcett I would like to come to you, if I may, please, sir. How extensive do you think the ties were between Sevan and Saddam at the time that all of this was beginning to take place, and how do you think it was that Sevan ended up being picked as the OIP director? Mr. Fawcett. That's a good question which I don't think we know the answers to. Mrs. Blackburn. Okay. Do you have insight that you can provide me? Mr. Fawcett. No further than what the Volcker Commission has come out with. However, I have encouraged the Volcker Commission to continue going down that path because I do not think we have gotten to the end of it. One of the trails that needs to be pursued is what is the money flow to Benon Savan, because I think if we start to peel that one back, we may end up shedding light again on longer-running money laundering structures of Saddam Hussein. Mrs. Blackburn. Okay. Let's go, at the same point, to Chief of Staff Riza and the relationship with Sevan. And do you think that they collaborated and worked together on much of this, and on some of the oil allocations? Mr. Fawcett. I haven't seen anything that shows that they collaborated. My understanding of the way Mr. Sevan ran his operation was that he was very insular and was not out going and collaborating with a lot of other senior U.N. officials. Mrs. Blackburn. What role do you think that Chief of Staff Riza might have played in the management of the program? Mr. Fawcett. I don't really know. Mrs. Blackburn. You don't know. Okay. Do you think Kofi Annan was aware of much of Sevan's activities? Mr. Fawcett. I wouldn't go as far as to say he was aware of the illicit activities that have been alleged. However, he was fully aware of the potential for that, fully aware that the Iraqis would attempt to do just what they did, attempt to bribe senior public officials around the world and in the U.N. . So I think he is culpable of not exerting executive authority over that program. Mrs. Blackburn. Okay. And then Boutrus Boutros-Ghali, what ties do you think exist between him and Saddam and administration of the Iraq escrow account; or do you think there were any? Mr. Fawcett. Certainly he had an awful lot of influence on the selection of the bank. That has become clear from the Volcker investigation, which showed no transparency process whatsoever. It was a manipulated process between the French and the Iraqis. Mrs. Blackburn. Do you think the French Government played a role in that? Mr. Fawcett. Yes, they did. Mrs. Blackburn. Let's see, I have got a couple of minutes. Mr. Chairman, I yield back. Thank you. Mr. Whitfield. You have no further questions? I call on Dr. Norwood for 10 minutes. Mr. Norwood. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. I would like to tell you something about this hearing. It is the most partisan one I've seen in a long time, and it is hard for grownups to understand and solve a problem when half the group is trying to change the subject. This is about the Oil-for-Food program, and we do need to understand it, and our people at home want to understand it. Dr. Gordon, you are an associate professor, are you not? Ms. Gordon. Correct. Mr. Norwood. Are you a lawyer? Ms. Gordon. I am both. I have a Ph.D. In philosophy and a J.D. In law. Mr. Norwood. How long have you been teaching? Ms. Gordon. In a faculty capacity since 1993. I taught as a graduate assistant prior to that. Mr. Norwood. Do you get up to the U.N. a lot, spend a lot of time up there? Ms. Gordon. I conduct some interviews from time to time. Mr. Norwood. Do you go up once a month or are you there annually? I am impressed with your knowledge of the U.N. It sounds like you are there every day. Ms. Gordon. I'm not there every day. Mr. Norwood. You are getting it from the Internet, I guess. Ms. Gordon. I get documents from all sorts of sources. Mr. Norwood. But you are having some pretty strong opinions on documents from all sources, and I'm sort of curious about that. Ms. Gordon. I'm also familiar with all of the scholarly literature in this area. I have conducted dozens of interviews with U.N. officials and diplomats. Mr. Norwood. Do you spend a lot of time up at the U.N. that led you to believe some of the things that you have been saying today? My understanding was you just decided to come testify Friday morning, is that about right? Ms. Gordon. I was called on Friday morning and invited to testify, and I accepted. Mr. Norwood. Do they offer to let you see these documents that have been translated? Ms. Gordon. No. Mr. Norwood. You haven't had an opportunity to read these? Mr. Norwood. I would love it if you would and report back if you have changes in attitude or thoughts about what your testimony is. Ms. Gordon. These are the documents that Mr. Smego translated in the binder? Mr. Norwood. Yes. The minority has that, and it would be helpful for you to read it. I would like to ask you if you think economic sanctions are a good thing anytime, anywhere. Ms. Gordon. In general, what the studies on economic sanctions demonstrate is the most optimistic, which is the Huffnauer-Shartenelli data base from the 1980's and more recently the 1990's, that in about a third of the cases they are a factor in changing and influencing the behavior of the target state. Mr. Norwood. Did that lead to the document, Using a Pick Axe for Brain Surgery, that you wrote? Ms. Gordon. The title, which was---- Mr. Norwood. No, the subject. Ms. Gordon. The title is a little inflammatory. The subject of that particular paper is the notion that because economic sanctions necessarily impact the civilian population that there is no way of, let's say just in war doctrine, discriminating between civilians---- Mr. Norwood. Let me ask you--I can't tell where you are on this exactly. It seems to me that you believe everything in the Oil-for-Food program worked perfectly and the U.N. acted correctly, or are you saying all of the things stated actually have happened, things that we are hearing today, things that none of us would be very much for, but all of that could have been stopped if only the United States would have stopped them? Where are you? Ms. Gordon. I think it is probably not either of those two positions. Mr. Norwood. Your testimony implies the first one. Your statements and some of the things you said imply the second one. Let me go to Mr. Fawcett. Ms. Gordon. I wonder if I could have a chance to answer that. Mr. Norwood. Hold it for a minute. I am watching the clock. I will get back to you. Let me---- Some people--Dr. Gordon is a good example--claim that the Oil-for-Food program was tremendously successful in helping the Iraqi people. Do you agree with that assessment? Mr. Fawcett. I don't think we have any data to show how many people it has helped and to what degree and qualitatively it has. I would point out one survey that was done in the last year by the U.N. in which the amount of people that they claim are totally dependent upon their aid has dropped from 60 percent of Iraq to 25 percent, which means 35 percent of Iraq, 7 to 8 million people, are now far better off. So either this invasion was the greatest humanitarian act---- Mr. Norwood. The Oil-for-Food program is what I am asking, though. Has that been successful? Mr. Fawcett. I don't think we have any data to show what success or failures it has had. Mr. Norwood. What you are saying is you believe nobody could actually determine that at this point? Mr. Fawcett. No one could determine it. What the U.N. has constantly said is 60 percent of the Iraqi people were totally dependent. In my experience in the humanitarian field for 10 to 15 years, I have not seen any population of which 60 percent will sit in their homes waiting for food to be delivered. It doesn't happen. Mr. Norwood. Dr. Gordon went on to state that the U.N. provided considerable information and data about the Oil-for- Food program. Do you agree with that? Mr. Fawcett. The data that was essential to stop any of the corruption was not released. The only data that came out was inadvertently leaked from the U.N. on occasion. This is the data that mentions company names and mentions pricing. None of the other data is relevant to preventing corruption. Mr. Norwood. Well, it appears to me that we are not getting the information or at least Congress is not getting the information as required. Dr. Volcker would be a good example of that. So it couldn't very well be said that we are getting correct information, at least in my opinion, from the U.N. Is it true that the Secretary had no decisionmaking roles in setting the terms of the Oil-for-Food program? Mr. Fawcett. That is not true. The Secretariat had ongoing daily decisionmaking capacity. The oversight was by the Security Council, and they could step in at any time. But all the data that was being passed to the Security Council, the options for the program, how it would change, were being provided by the U.N. itself. Mr. Norwood. Is the Secretary a hands-on kind of fellow? Does he delegate and just sort of didn't know what was going on or do you think he knew what was going on? Mr. Fawcett. I think he knew what was going on, yes. Mr. Norwood. Do you think the oil voucher system was mostly a benign recordkeeping system of Saddam's regime? Mr. Fawcett. Absolutely not. The recordkeeping system of graft, of corruption and political slush fund, I don't believe all members of the Security Council knew of the existence or the details of the voucher regime. I believe that only came out after the toppling of Saddam. Mr. Norwood. Do you think we can prove that today? Do we have enough information out and documentation out that we could prove that? Mr. Fawcett. The existence of the voucher system or that-- -- Mr. Norwood. The voucher system actually worked and was honest. Mr. Fawcett. When it first came out, there was skepticism because it came out in the Iraqi newspaper and maybe was pushed by some of the Iraqi political factions. But the fact that the Duelfer or ISG report came out and looked at that in some depth gave me more confidence to believe it is correct. We are now seeing many investigations around the world, not just here in Washington, that are starting to prove that this original document was correct. Mr. Norwood. I will ask you one last one and perhaps a few in writing, but this one is important to me. Did the retroactive pricing of oil contracts cause oil exports to collapse as suggested by Dr. Gordon and ultimately harm the Iraqi people? Mr. Fawcett. No. Mr. Norwood. I am interested in that. Mr. Fawcett. You have to look at the time line. Iraqi smuggling was ongoing at that period. It was really taking off. Iraq was not as interested in exporting through the Oil-for- Food program as they were making far more money from the smuggling through the pipeline. So the retroactive pricing, they could afford to stall, hedge and wait. So I don't think that that had a negative impact upon the Iraqi populous; and, once again, if it did, we have no data, reliable data to show it. Mr. Norwood. Why did we do retroactive pricing? Mr. Fawcett. In order to cut out the cutback or the premium on the oil sales. Mr. Norwood. Explain that. Mr. Fawcett. The manipulation of pricing--oil was underpriced. So if oil was supposed to be at $20 a barrel, the Iraqis and the oil overseers would agree to $19.50 a barrel, which would be another $.50 to fiddle around. Doesn't sound like much, but on a tanker load that is a million dollars. Retroactive pricing meant that the buyer didn't know what they were going to pay for it until after they delivered it or at least after they lifted the oil. So it eliminated that maneuvering of pricing. Mr. Norwood. Do you think that was a proper thing to do to stop that kickback scheme? Mr. Fawcett. I think that was one of the options they had and had to go with it. I want to point out that for 2 years under this program the oil overseers were a French expert and a Russian expert and for 1 year only the Russian was the oil overseer. When the new oil overseers were appointed, a Danish man and a Dutch, within 1 month was when the Iraqis insisted upon having an overt premium. Mr. Norwood. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Whitfield. Thank you. First panel has been here a couple of hours. I have about two or three more questions to complete the record from my perspective, and I will recognize Mr. Stupak. He has a few additional questions as well. First, Mr. Fawcett, under the voucher system, what the 661 Committee would see, it is my understanding, was a contract between SOMO and the oil company that did the lifting, but they would not see or be aware of the underlying grant of oil to the individual that Iraq wished to influence? Mr. Fawcett. That is correct. Not only would the 661 Committee not see it but most likely U.N. officials would also not see it. Mr. Whitfield. Now, Mr. Smego, originally I was talking to you about Exhibits 6 and 7 and Saddam's efforts to influence the French. One of the individuals that was identified was Roselyn Bachelot. Did you find any documents that purportedly chronicled meetings between the Iraqi intelligence service and Mrs. Bachelot? Mr. Smego. Yes, Ms. Bachelot was noted in Exhibit 9, for example. Mr. Whitfield. What does it state in there? Mr. Smego. In April 2002, a representative in Paris World wrote a memo regarding his meeting with the French parliament member, Ms. Bachelot. Mr. Whitfield. What was her title or position? Mr. Smego. Her position was the--she was the national assembly deputy and spokeswoman for Chirac's 2002 Presidential campaign. The documents state as such, and the committee staff confirmed that as well. Mr. Whitfield. Exhibit 12, would you walk us through that quickly. Mr. Smego. Exhibit 12 was a memorandum from May 2002 regarding the meeting of the French representative in Paris with Ms. Bachelot stating that, number 2--point 2, she assured that the French position opposed any American tax on the nation, and France used the right of opposition. In parentheses following that was a veto within the Security Council against any American decision regarding the attack on Iraq and that Iraq issued its statement that it is prepared to offer financial support to Chirac for his election campaign. The message was passed on to the financial official of the election campaign. But I do want to make clear that the offer of campaign contribution was declined by the---- Mr. Whitfield. No record of the campaign contribution? Mr. Smego. There is no record within that document, but it says the official declined it. Mr. Whitfield. And then one other question. Vladimir Zhirinovsky, I know there is some documentation of him. He is a member of the Russian duma. From your translations, did he receive any oil vouchers? Mr. Smego. Yes, Mr. Zhirinovsky received quite a few oil allocations. Specifically, Exhibits 23 through 30 specify the majority of the Russian oil allocations to Mr. Zhirinovsky, who was the head of the Russian liberal democratic party. Mr. Whitfield. Thank you very much. At this time, I recognize Mr. Stupak. Mr. Stupak. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Fawcett, are you the author of this Exhibit Number 42 in our book, Sources of Revenue for Saddam and Sons: A Primer of the Financial Underpinnings of the Regime in Baghdad? Mr. Fawcett. Yes. Mr. Stupak. Are you the sole author? Mr. Fawcett. There are two of us. Mr. Stupak. Have you done subsequent writing since then? Mr. Fawcett. I haven't done much writing but a lot of research. Mr. Stupak. On this? Mr. Fawcett. On the Oil-for-Food. Mr. Stupak. Because I'm looking at some of these statements in here, and what you are testifying to really looks a little different. Like on page 13 when we talked about the overseers and Russia was in control and sort of insinuated that they had complete control, but the Dutch in the fall of 2000 were the overseers? Mr. Fawcett. By the fall of 2000, there were three. Mr. Stupak. Are you alleging that the oil overseers were in on the oil surcharges? Mr. Fawcett. I am alleging--certainly not by the fall of 2000. I don't believe they were. Earlier than that, under the French and Russian watch, I think there was an awful lot of underpricing of oil. It had not yet gone out into the public. I do not have any documentation to show that the French or Russian oil overseers were taking money. Mr. Stupak. You didn't state that in the report. You talked about the three overseers, one being the United States in there for awhile, and then they resigned. Mr. Fawcett. When the U.S. oil overseer resigned after about 18 months of the program, it was the next month that the first fight began on oil pricing between the Security Council and Iraq. Mr. Stupak. You didn't say that in your report, and that's what we relied upon, and now your testimony is a lot different here today. Mr. Fawcett. The report is 3 years old. Mr. Stupak. About 2 years old. Just over 2 years. That is why I asked you if you have any subsequent writings to try to clarify what you are saying. Mr. Fawcett. No. I think the oil overseers when they came-- the new oil overseers came in in the fall of 2000 is exactly the same period of time when two other things were happening, the opening of the Syrian pipeline and the Iraqis demanding an overt kickback. Mr. Stupak. On page 23 of your report, you said the second half of 2000. Because France only went so far in advocating reform of U.N. sanctions, rather than Iraq's preferred option of lifting them entirely, the French company saw their market share slashed dramatically. Mr. Fawcett. That is right. Mr. Stupak. The Oil-for-Food program, Saddam Hussein leveraged it for political gain and also for trying to lift sanctions? Mr. Fawcett. Correct. And he would try to leverage the French, and one way of leveraging them was to pull away the support he was giving them. Mr. Stupak. In this report, you talked a lot about the U.N. oversight and the lack of oversight and the 661 Committee or the standing committee. Nowhere did you mention the Secretary General, but you talked a lot about him today. Mr. Fawcett. Right. This was a portion of the report that we did not--or a topic we did not go into. Mr. Stupak. The stuff you said about the Secretary General, do you have documents to back that up? Mr. Fawcett. Most of the allegations against the Secretary General have come out in the last year, the allegation about the improprieties of his son. Mr. Stupak. To make allegations is one thing, but to be able to factually back them up is another thing. Do you have any documents to back them up? Mr. Fawcett. The documents against the Secretary General in the Volcker Commission are the worst. I have gone back in the history and the public record and found the activities of the Secretary General vis-a-vis Iraq. Did not do it in 2002. Mr. Stupak. Do you have any documents? Mr. Fawcett. Plenty of documents. Mr. Stupak. We will ask you to produce those for the committee. Since you are the author of this report, can you explain this to me? The first year the Oil-for-Food program is found, page 17. 1997, U.S. Only took 13 percent of the Oil-for-Food program of the oil, still the largest end user. By 1999, the U.S. portion had climbed to 35 percent; and since September 11 the U.S. has been purchasing well over 50 percent of all the Iraqi oil sold under the Oil-for-Food program. And you go on to say, and I am not clear either, not clear why the U.S. purchased such large quantities of Iraqi oil in the wake of September 11 and amid the heightened threats toward the Baghdad regime emanating from Washington and this administration. If we know the program isn't working at solving what it is supposed to solve and give humanitarian aid to Iraq and we are threatening war against them and trying to blame them for September 11, even though they had nothing to do with September 11, why would we continue to buy oil to fill the coffers of Saddam Hussein? That are the questions my constituents ask me, not this other stuff about the U.N. Mr. Fawcett. We could not explain it. We had no explanation for why we were doing it, which is why we reported that. Mr. Stupak. Dr. Gordon, I only have a few minutes left, but every time you tried to answer a question, you got cutoff. Any of those questions you want to explain from Dr. Burgess, Mr. Norwood or Ms. Blackburn? And you didn't ask this committee to testify? You were invited to testify. Ms. Gordon. Yes, sir. Mr. Stupak. You were asked by this committee to testify. You didn't ask us to testify? Ms. Gordon. I certainly didn't do that. If I could address a few points very briefly, and if I could address a couple of statements Mr. Fawcett made for clarification. When Mr. Fawcett and maybe someone else was talking about the oil overseers after the American and Norwegian left and there was only the French and Russian and there was implication there that then they were being self-serving, that is incorrect. That's not how that committee worked. The way it worked for the oil overseers is that two oil overseers had to sign off on every contract, and no oil overseer could sign off on any contract of his own nation. Mr. Stupak. Russia has their own oil and basically bought this oil for food and sold it back to the United States? Ms. Gordon. I am not familiar with that. When it was down to two or when it was even at three or when it was at two, then any time that a French contract came up or a Russian contract came up, since there were not two oil overseers from non-French or non-Russian countries to sign off on that, then that was circulated to the entire 661 Committee. That is what happened when that occurred. There was a control in place. It's incorrect to suggest that there wasn't, which specifically prevented self-dealing in that form. Second, I would like to comment on the representative from Tennessee's comment about the baby formula. With all due respect, an increase in baby formula is not a major factor in child death in Iraq. I will tell you what is a major factor, a lack of potable water. That's what spikes child mortality. If you want to know what was responsible for the lack of potable water, it was the absence of sewage and water treatment equipment and, specifically, electricity to generate them. If you want to look at what particular goods the United States blocked systematically throughout the sanctions regime including the Oil-for-Food program, it was the electricity sector, communications sector, transportation. If you want examples of what, in fact, caused large-scale child mortality in Iraq, it was such things as the U.S. blocking $200 million of child vaccines. It was the U.S. blocking water tankers during a period of drought in a country with high mortality from water-borne diseases. It was the U.S. agreeing to approve a sewage treatment plant in Iraq and blocking the generator to run it. If I could address the issue of data, Mr. Fawcett has said there was no reliable data on either the humanitarian situation or the severity of it prior to the Oil-for-Food program. That is incorrect. If you look at the scholarship of the leading medical demographers and public health experts from Harvard, Columbia, and Johns Hopkins, published in the leading public health and medical journals, you will see something very different. You will see measurements, fresh data,not based on the Iraqi government, not based on the Iraqi government's data, which demonstrates both the severity of the humanitarian situation as of 1996 and substantial improvements that happened in the humanitarian situation under the Oil-for-Food program. And, last, I would like to address the claim that the Secretary General had an ongoing daily decisionmaking process in the Oil-for-Food program. That is incorrect. At every point the structure of the program was determined by Security Council resolutions and decisions made by the 661 Committee. The Secretary General had no decisionmaking role in that. That was something because it was a program under the auspices of Chapter 7 of the U.N. charter that was entirely the creation and under the supervision and monitoring of the Security Council. Thank you for giving me the opportunity. Mr. Stupak. Mr. Fawcett, smart sanctions, which was U.N. Resolution 1409, that sort of lifted any kind of control that was left in this whole program, right, that was implemented May 14 to the smart sanctions? Can you explain how that sort of lifted any international control? Mr. Fawcett. No. I am not up to speed on the smart sanctions approach. Mr. Stupak. It's found on page 20 of your report. Because you said here, the new sanctions regime will actually weaken international control and facilitate increased hard currency opportunities for the Hussein regime in two ways. First, all efforts to increase international monitoring or oversight of sanctions busting trade with Iraq were abandoned in the course of negotiations leading to the passage of the resolution; and, second, the streamlined procedures will make it much easier for Iraqi officials to insist upon kickbacks, on contracts supplying goods to the Oil-for-Food program. Mr. Fawcett. I am with you now. That was a process by which the oversight from the Security Council was lessened and more responsibility was actually put onto the Secretariat, upon the U.N. officials, to approve contracts without having them go through the Security Council. So whatever limited oversight the Security Council had been providing previously, which was limited, was decreased. Mr. Stupak. No way in the Security Council or any form in the U.N. does the Secretary General have a vote on the Security Council or anything? Mr. Fawcett. No. Mr. Whitfield. Gentleman's time has expired. Mr. Stupak and I had two opportunities. If there is anyone else who wants to ask a question, then we will terminate this panel. Mr. Burgess was recognized first. Mrs. Blackburn. Mrs. Blackburn. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I did have just a couple more questions that I wanted to come back to now that we are through this, and I know we are all ready to hear from Mr. Anderson. Dr. Gordon, I would like to come back to you. You have a great deal of knowledge of the inner workings of the U.N. and seem very supportive of what you saw carried out in this program. It had been reported and we had heard that Chief of Staff Riza had shredded some documents that were related to the program. Do you know if he had the authority to shred those documents and who may have given him that authority? Do you know anything about that situation? Ms. Gordon. The only small amount I know about is the documents were redundant. They were a second set. Other than that, I don't know anything about that event. Mrs. Blackburn. And then talking again about Mr. Sevan, my question--and since you have knowledge of the workings of the U.N. in this program, my question to you would be, how did he manage to seemingly disobey U.N. rules and not really raise any suspicions, just kind of work, you know, on his own framework or maybe on his own timetable or maybe under his own direction, if you will? Do you have any insight you could offer to that? Ms. Gordon. Your question is---- Mrs. Blackburn. How is he able to do it without raising suspicions within the U.N. Organization? Ms. Gordon. You are referring specifically to the claim that he received an oil voucher? Mrs. Blackburn. Uh-huh. Ms. Gordon. I assume in the same process as has been described before. The way the Security Council designed this program is that the company names were registered and the company names, as long as they were sold--as long as those companies corresponded to the contracts and the contracts conformed to the formulas approved by the 661 Committee, that's what took place. What happened with the vouchers was entirely outside that system. None of the vouchers at any point would have come through that system. Mrs. Blackburn. So then what you are saying is you don't think there was oversight of his activities in that regard and that would not have been abnormal for there not to have been oversight of his activities? Ms. Gordon. There is enormous oversight of his activities. If you look at the reports he presented---- Mrs. Blackburn. Within a certain framework. Ms. Gordon. If you want to know whether the voucher came through, obviously, it did not. Mrs. Blackburn. Mr. Chairman, I yield back. Mr. Whitfield. Mr. Burgess. Mr. Burgess. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Just a couple of additional questions for Mr. Smego. On the documents that have been provided to us in the binder, I believe it is document number 7, in that your translation work showed you that there was opportunity to discuss the political fortunes of Mr. Chirac of France and Mr. Putin of Russia, is that correct? Mr. Smego. Yes, specifically the people through whom the French President Jacques Chirac and Russian President Vladimir Putin could be approached by the Iraqi intelligence service. Mr. Burgess. Are there other documents then that show that Russian political figures received oil allocations from Saddam Hussein? Mr. Smego. Certainly. There were some documents from the Russian Asbecht. For example, Exhibit 30, which is a spreadsheet, handwritten, that outlines the different oil allocations during phase 7, specifically, the second handwritten point at the bottom for Mr. Zhirinovsky and the third for Ms. Sazhi in the political Science Committee. Ms. Sazhi was identified as the head of the peace and unity party of Russia. Mr. Burgess. I know Mr. Waxman has pointed out this is our 13th hearing, but bear with me because this is my first. Who is Vladimir Zhirinovsky? Mr. Smego. Vladimir Zhirinovsky was the head of the Russian liberal democratic party. Mr. Burgess. And could you walk us through the documents that show that Mr. Zhirinovsky received oil allocations from Saddam Hussein? Mr. Smego. I believe starting off at 26--starting off at Exhibit 23, Mr. Zhirinovsky requested some cooperation in contracting. Exhibit 24 discusses the subject of the special quantity of crude oil to Mr. Vladimir Zhirinovsky, and the company belonging to Mr. Zhirinovsky has not registered itself in the United Nations until now. Exhibit 26 would be a memorandum from Tariq Aziz to the minister of oil regarding a Russian delegation that was going to arrive in October 1997 to complete the special contracts regarding the Oil-for-Food products and that the Saddamco company is registered in Iraq and the United Nations to purchase oil on behalf of that Russian liberal democratic party. Subsequent Exhibit 27 mentions 1.8 barrel contract during phase 2 for Saddamco. That is on October 7, approximately 2 days after that delegation was to arrive. Mr. Burgess. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I yield back. Mr. Whitfield. Thank you, Dr. Burgess. I thank this panel for their testimony today, and at this time you are dismissed. We will call our second panel: Mr. Gerald C. Anderson, who is the Director of the Office of Peacekeeping, Sanctions and Counterterrorism, U.S. Department of State. Mr. Anderson, good afternoon. You are aware that the committee is holding an investigative hearing and when doing so we have had the practice of taking testimony under oath. Do you have any objection to taking testimony under oath or giving it under oath? Mr. Anderson. No objection. Mr. Whitfield. The Chair then advises you that under the rule of the House and the rules of the committee you are entitled to be advised by counsel. Do you desire to be advised by counsel during your testimony today? Mr. Anderson. No, thank you. Mr. Whitfield. If you would please rise and raise your right hand, I will swear you in. [Witness sworn.] Mr. Whitfield. You are now under oath. Mr. Anderson, you may give your 5-minute opening statement. I didn't want Mr. Stupak---- Mr. Stupak. I am listening. TESTIMONY OF GERALD C. ANDERSON, DIRECTOR, OFFICE OF PEACEKEEPING, SANCTIONS AND COUNTERTERRORISM, U.S. DEPARTMENT OF STATE Mr. Anderson. Mr. Chairman and distinguished members of the committee, I welcome the opportunity to appear before you to discuss the U.N. Oil-for-Food program and to answer your questions on various aspects of the management and execution of the program. The Oil-for-Food program was adopted in 1995 to alleviate the serious humanitarian crisis while maintaining comprehensive restrictive measures on items that Saddam Hussein could use to then pose a threat to his neighbors in the region and this at a time when many were calling for an end to those restrictions. The 661 Committee monitored the implementation of the Oil-for- Food program and through each of its members was also responsible for reviewing humanitarian contracts, oil spare parts contracts and oil pricing submitted on a regular basis by Iraq to the U.N. for approval. The U.S. delegation was an active participant in all such reviews. However, the 661 Committee operated on a consensus basis as a subsidiary body of the Security Council. The efforts of the U.S. and the United Kingdom to counter or address noncompliance were often negated by other members' desires to ease sanctions on Iraq, often exacerbated by the actions of certain key member states in advancing self-serving national economic objectives. Clearly, the sanctions failed to force the regime of Saddam Hussein to comply with international obligations, but they did succeed in limiting Iraqi efforts to rebuild their military capabilities. The major shortcomings of the OFF program have been widely documented in recent months, but the program did succeed in its basic humanitarian objective of ensuring that the Iraqi people were adequately fed. Much of what the U.S. Government could and could not achieve with regard to monitoring the program was directly related to the politics surrounding Iraq and the Security Council. U.S. efforts to keep the comprehensive sanctions regime in place were repeatedly challenged by Council members whose national firms would derive economic benefit from the lifting of sanctions. Indeed, starting in the mid 1990's and continuing to 2001, these pressures to lift sanctions grew. Violations with respect to the Oil-for-Food program manifested themselves in a whole pull-down menu of manipulative mechanisms in order to circumvent the sanctions, including surcharges, topping off, influence peddling, product substitution, product diversion, phony service contracts, phantom spare parts, shell corporations, illusory performance bonds, hidden bank accounts and plain old-fashioned bribery and kickbacks to the tune of several billion dollars. Mr. Chairman, some members of the Security Council did not take their international obligations seriously and either directly or indirectly facilitated sanctions busting activities by the Saddam regime. The 661 Committee was mired in a political debate with regard to Iraq that often impeded it from taking action against violators of the embargo; and, as the recent Volcker Committee reports indicate, there are serious charges that U.N. officials may have allowed Saddam to further undermine their system. When in late 2000 the U.N. Oil overseers reported excessive premiums on oil experts, the 661 Committee, led by the U.S. and the U.K., agreed to a statement on December 15, 2000, making clear that additional fees above the selling price approved by the 661 Committee were not acceptable. Despite circulation of this message to all oil companies approved to lift Iraqi oil, evidence of the illicit surcharges continued during the spring of 2001. The U.S., working in close coordination with the British delegation, raised the issue of excessive oil price premiums in a series of more than 40 formal and informal 661 Committee and Security Council meetings during that period. After months of stalemate, the U.S. and British experts made creative use of the consensus rule governing decisions in the 661 Committee by withholding support until the end of the month on oil pricing proposals submitted at the beginning of the month by the Iraqis. As a result, by the spring of 2002, the oil price variation or surcharge for market levels had been reduced from as much as $.50 per barrel to an accepted industry variation of $0.03 to $.05 per barrel. Allegations of kickbacks to the Oil-for-Food program began to surface in late 2000. The U.S. and British experts raised this issue with the 661 Committee experts and the Office of Iraq Programs representatives in 2000 and early 2001 and formally submitted proposals to address this issue during a 661 Committee meeting in March 2001. However, no documentary evidence was available at the time to support the allegations, and other committee members claimed that, without this evidence, no action can be taken. The United States frequently provided members of the 661 Committee and the Security Council with information and evidence of sanctions violations by the Saddam regime, including on Saddam's diverting funds to benefit Iraq's elite and on his attempts to procure WMD-related materials. In March 2002, a U.S. interagency team briefed the 661 Committee on the regime's diversion of trucks. U.S. commanders of the multi-lateral interception force in the Gulf briefed the committee each year starting in 1996 on illegal smuggling of Iraqi crude oil, including through the unauthorized use of ferry services from neighboring states. An equally noteworthy source of oil smuggling was through Iraq's pipeline with Syria which restarted in late November 2000. The U.S., in coordination with the U.K., repeatedly raised concerns over this blatant noncompliance only to be told by Syria that the pipeline was, quote, being tested. Mr. Chairman, thank you for this opportunity to appear before the committee. I now stand ready to answer whatever questions you and your fellow committee members may have. [The prepared statement of Gerald Anderson follows:] Prepared Statement of Gerald C. Anderson, Director, Office of Peacekeeping, Sanctions and Counter-Terrorism, Bureau of International Organization Affairs, U.S. Department of State Mr. Chairman, distinguished members of the Committee, I welcome the opportunity to appear before you to discuss the U.N. oil-for-food program and to answer your questions on various aspects of the management and execution of the program. Mr. Chairman, let me start by discussing why the Iraq sanctions were imposed and why the Oil-for-Food Program was established. Four days after Iraq invaded Kuwait in 1990, the Security Council adopted Resolution 661, which imposed comprehensive trade and financial sanctions against the former Iraqi regime. The United States government supported this measure as part of a larger strategy to force Iraq to cease hostilities and to withdraw its forces from Kuwait. At the end of the Gulf War in 1991, the Security Council adopted Resolution 687 that extended comprehensive sanctions on Iraq to ensure that Saddam Hussein complied with the major provisions of the ceasefire. By retaining the sanctions, the Council also sought to deny Iraq the capability of rearming or constituting its weapons of mass destruction and other military programs. The sanctions were not anticipated to remain in place for more than a year or two before Saddam complied. We now know that Saddam chose not to comply. By 1995 in the wake of deteriorating humanitarian conditions in Iraq, many in the international community called for an end to the restrictions, reflecting concern that the impact of the sanctions was being borne primarily by the innocent Iraqi civilian population. In April 1995 the Security Council adopted Resolution 986, establishing the Oil-for-Food Program to alleviate the serious humanitarian crisis while maintaining comprehensive restrictive measures to deny Saddam access to items that he could use to again pose a threat to his neighbors in the region. The sanctions committee that was established under Resolution 661 in 1991, the 661 Committee, monitored the implementation of the overall sanctions regime on Iraq, and after the adoption of Resolution 986, it also monitored the implementation of the Oil-for-Food Program. The 661 Committee, like all sanctions committees, operated as a subsidiary body of the Security Council. Unlike the Council, decisions were made on a consensus basis requiring the agreement of all parties and members. In addition to providing general oversight of the Oil-for- Food Program and to monitoring member state compliance with the sanctions, the committee, through each of its members, was also responsible for reviewing humanitarian contracts, oil spare parts contracts and oil pricing submitted on a regular basis by Iraq to the U.N. for approval. The U.S. delegation was an active participant in all such reviews. The efforts of the U.S. and the United Kingdom to counter or address non-compliance were often negated by other members' desires to ease sanctions on Iraq. The atmosphere in the committee, particularly as the program evolved during the late 1990s, became increasingly contentious. The fundamental political disagreement between members over the Council's imposition of comprehensive sanctions was often exacerbated by the actions of certain key member states in advancing self-serving national economic objectives. In retrospect, although the consensus rule often stymied progress in the committee, that same consensus rule helped the U.S. achieve its objectives in a number of critical ways. The imposition of a retroactive pricing mechanism and our ability to place holds on humanitarian contracts that contained potential dual- use items were both made possible by the use of the consensus rule. Judging the success or failure of the Iraq sanctions depends on the view of their objectives. Clearly they failed to force the regime of Saddam Hussein to comply with its international obligations. But they did succeed in limiting Iraqi efforts to rebuild their military capabilities after the Gulf War. As regards the Oil-for-Food Program, similar considerations apply. The major shortcomings of the program have been widely documented in recent months, but the Oil-for-Food Program did succeed in its humanitarian objective of ensuring that the Iraqi people were adequately fed, thus limiting the impact of sanctions on them. Much of what the U.S. Government could and could not achieve with regard to monitoring the program and implementation of the sanctions was directly related to the political situation surrounding the contentious issue of Iraq in the Security Council and in the 661 Committee. U.S. efforts to keep the comprehensive sanctions regime in place repeatedly were challenged by Council members who complained about the humanitarian impact of sanctions on the Iraqi people, and whose national firms would derive economic benefit from the lifting of sanctions. Indeed, starting in the mid-1990s and continuing into 2001, these pressures to lift sanctions grew. Violations with respect to the oil-for-food program manifested themselves in a whole pull-down menu of manipulative mechanisms in order to circumvent the sanctions, including surcharges, topping off, influence pedaling, product substitution, product diversion, phony service contracts, phantom spare parts, shell corporations, illusory performance bonds, hidden bank accounts and then plain old fashioned bribery and kick backs to the tune of several billion dollars. Let me provide examples in two key areas: manipulation of oil pricing and kickbacks on the oil-for-food program. The first regards oil flowing out of Iraq. The former Iraqi regime, through the State Oil Marketing Organization, proposed prices for various markets and grades of crude for review by the U.N. Oil Overseers, and for approval by the 661 Committee. The U.N. Oil Overseers and committee members verified that the purchase price of the petroleum and the petroleum products were reasonable in light of prevailing market conditions. Evidence that the Iraqis were attempting to impose excessive price premiums on oil exports to exploit differences between oil prices approved by the 661 Committee and subsequent fluctuations in global oil prices surfaced as early as the fall of 2000, when the UN oil overseers informed the 661 Committee of instances in which the GOI was requesting imposition of an additional fee on the sale of Iraqi crude. My second example involves goods coming into Iraq. Again, there was a clear division of responsibility. While Iraqis retained the authority to contract with specific suppliers under the oil-for-food program, the 661 Committee was tasked with ensuring that the contracted goods were appropriate for export to Iraq under the conditions set out in Security Council Resolution 986. Once a contract was approved by the committee and the goods shipped, the U.N. inspections agent, Lloyds Register, and later Cotecna, were responsible for authenticating the arrival of these goods into Iraq. Separately, it was the responsibility of member states to prevent sanctioned goods from entering into Iraq. Mr. Chairman, I offer these examples to illustrate exactly where responsibility lay. There were, in hindsight, substantial problems related to all of these areas of responsibility. Some members did not take their international obligations seriously and either directly or indirectly facilitated sanctions-busting activities by the Saddam regime. The 661 Committee was mired in a political debate with regard to Iraq that often impeded it from taking action against violators of the embargo. And as the recent Volcker Independent Inquiry Committee reports indicate, there are serious charges that U.N. officials may have allowed Saddam to further undermine their system. I stated earlier that the United States has made every effort to address violations within the 661 Committee, even though we were often impeded by other committee members. In late 2000, U.N. Oil Overseers reported that Iraqis were attempting to impose excessive premiums on oil exports. The 661 Committee, led by the United States and the United Kingdom, agreed to a statement on December 15, 2000, making clear that additional fees above the selling price approved by the 661 Committee were not acceptable. Despite circulation of this message to all companies approved to lift Iraqi oil, evidence of the illicit surcharges continued during the spring of 2001. The United States, working in close coordination with the British delegation, raised the issue of excessive oil price premiums in a series of more than 40 formal and informal 661 Committee and Security Council meetings during that period. After months of stalemate within the committee, the U.S. and British experts made creative use of the consensus rule governing decisions in the 661 Committee by withholding support until the end of the month on oil pricing proposals submitted at the beginning of the month by the Iraqis. This retroactive price analysis gave the U.S. and British experts the opportunity to compare oil prices sought to the actual market price of similar crude oils to determine if SOMO's prices reflected fair market value--a requirement under Resolution 986. Beginning in October 2001, the United States and United Kingdom regularly employed the retroactive pricing mechanism to evaluate SOMO's prices until the suspension of the oil-for-food program in 2003. The retroactive oil pricing we imposed had the intended effect. By the spring of 2002, the U.N. Oil Overseers reported that the oil price variation from market levels had been reduced from as much as 50 cents per barrel to an accepted industry variation of 3 to 5 cents. Separately, allegation of kickbacks to the oil-for-food program began to surface in late 2000. U.S. and British experts raised this issue with the 661 Committee experts and the Office of the Iraq Program's representatives in 2002 and early 2001 and formally submitted proposals to address this issue during a 661 Committee meeting in March 2001. However, no documentary evidence was available at the time to support these allegations. Consequently, our proposals received no support. Committee members claimed that, absent evidence indicating that such kickbacks existed, no action could be taken. Important measures taken to address this issue occurred after the fall of Saddam's regime, when the United States, through the Coalition Provisional Authority, was informed of the kickback scheme by Iraqi ministry representatives in Baghdad. With the fall of the Hussein regime in the spring of 2003, and with the subsequent authorities granted under U.N. Security Council Resolution 1483, CPA officials, in coordination with U.N. officials and Iraqis, took steps to eliminate surcharges in the remaining oil-for-food contracts. In addition to eliminating and countering surcharges and kickbacks, the United States also took initiatives to provide members of the 661 Committee and the Security Council with information and evidence of violations by the Saddam regime, during various briefings. The United States briefed Security Council members in 2000 on the various ways the Saddam regime was diverting funds to benefit Iraq's elite, including through the use of diverted funds to build and furnish Saddam's palaces. The U.S. again briefed Security Council ambassadors in the spring of 2002 on Saddam's noncompliance with U.N. Security Council resolutions, and Saddam's attempts to procure WMD-related materials. In March of 2002, a U.S. interagency team briefed the 661 Committee on the regime's diversion of trucks. U.S. commanders of the Multilateral Interception Force, or MIF, in the Gulf also briefed the committee each year starting in 1996 on the MIF's activities in combating the illegal smuggling of Iraqi crude oil. MIF Commanders in 2001 and 2002 briefed the 661 Committee and highlighted the continued attempts by Saddam Hussein to circumvent sanctions by illegally exporting oil and illicitly importing materials into Iraq through the unauthorized use of ferry services from neighboring states. The MIF operating in the Persian Gulf enjoyed success from 2000- 2001 in significantly reducing the number of small vessels operating out of Shatt al-Arab that were smuggling Iraqi oil along Iran's southern coast. An equally noteworthy source of oil smuggling prior to the 2003 Iraq war was the illegal flow of oil through Iraq's pipeline with Syria, which restarted operations in late November 2000. The United States, in coordination with the UK, repeatedly raised concerns over such blatant non-compliance, only to be told by Syrian representatives that the Iraq-Syria pipeline was ``being tested,'' but was not operational. The oil-for-food program was a unique endeavor, and although it was essential to the Iraqi people, it was also manipulated by Saddam Hussein and his cronies to undermine the sanctions. Mr. Chairman, thank you for this opportunity to appear before the committee, I now stand ready to answer whatever questions you and your fellow committee members may wish to pose. Mr. Whitfield. Thank you, Mr. Anderson. How long have you been with the State Department? Mr. Anderson. I joined the State Department in August 1980. Mr. Whitfield. How long have you been involved in this oil- for-food issue? Mr. Anderson. I became director of this office in July 2004. Mr. Whitfield. Who was the U.S. representative on the 661 Committee? Mr. Anderson. The 661 Committee was a committee of the Security Council; and, therefore, our mission was represented and our permanent representative was the senior representative. But most committee sessions were attended by our sanctions unit chief at the U.S. mission to the United Nations in New York. Mr. Whitfield. Now, in your testimony, you talk about that self-serving national economic objectives often worsened fundamental political disagreements between members of the Security Council. Can you provide a specific example of this? Mr. Anderson. The reference there was, by looking at the members of the Security Council and the 661 Committee with whom we debated measures to deal with noncompliance, with sanctions and with these various manipulative devices that I listed in my statement, it was clear that countries that had an interest in selling more of their products, their companies' products to Iraq, tended to take positions more favorable to Iraq. Mr. Whitfield. The oil surcharge would be one example? Mr. Anderson. That would be one example. Mr. Whitfield. When did the U.S. become aware that Saddam was demanding an oil surcharge? Mr. Anderson. The oil overseers first informed the 661 Committee in December 2000 about the blatant attempts to impose the surcharges of up to $0.50. Mr. Whitfield. Did the U.S. raise concerns about this with the 661 Committee? Mr. Anderson. Yes. Mr. Whitfield. How many times did they attempt to address the issue of oil surcharges with the 661 Committee? Mr. Anderson. As I mentioned, over 40 times. I have a list of a number of particular dates when those issues were raised, and I would characterize it as an iterative process where we sought to find a solution that would be acceptable to the committee through a consensus of the committee and would also be effective in ending the oil surcharges. Mr. Whitfield. And the U.S--I assume you made written requests about this or sent written documents to the committee expressing their concern? Mr. Anderson. We did submit a number of written documents accompanying our various proposals on this issue over time. Mr. Whitfield. And which states resisted American efforts to eliminate the surcharge? Mr. Anderson. Generally speaking, the U.S. and the U.K. Were like-minded in general. Occasionally, we had some differences of opinion on tactics, but we were generally with them and the other permanent members of the Security Council and some of the nonpermanent members of the Security Council such as, for example, Syria who, during part of the program, during one 2-year period was a member of the Council and a member of the Committee. Mr. Whitfield. Basically, France, Russia and China were those---- Mr. Anderson. Those were the other three permanent members. Mr. Whitfield. What were their stated reasons for objecting to removing the surcharges? Mr. Anderson. In general, the first type of reaction to proposals to deal with the surcharges was challenging the evidence that was available for the surcharges. Another common argument was to claim that action on the surcharges would affect the humanitarian situation in Iraq negatively or would cause the net revenue coming into the program to decline, which would therefore reduce the amount of funds under the program available to procure humanitarian supplies. Mr. Whitfield. And yet the surcharges themselves were definitely reducing the amount of money, humanitarian aid going to Iraq? Mr. Anderson. That was clearly our argument, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Whitfield. But you were never successful in getting them to correct that, is that correct? Mr. Anderson. That's correct. We did, however, de facto implement a system of retroactive pricing that was referred to in the first panel, which we implemented not by consensus in the committee, because we never obtained a consensus, but through the system of holds on oil prices. In other words, we exercised our right under the consensus system to place a hold on any oil contracts until the end of the month when it was known what the market price for that oil was during that month. And that was the mechanism that we used to implement retroactive pricing. It was over the objections of other members of the committee. Mr. Whitfield. In some of our testimony, Dr. Gordon--my impression was that everything decided at the 661 Committee had to be unanimous and the fact that the U.S. was not objecting seemed to indicate that the U.S. was going along with everything that was happening. But what you have just described is a little bit different than that. Mr. Anderson. Mr. Chairman, I'm not sure which issue your reference to objecting is, but I would just reiterate there were many disputes within the committee over policy decisions and the---- Mr. Whitfield. There were a lot of disputes, I take it? Mr. Anderson. Yes. Mr. Whitfield. In Exhibit 46, I notice that the U.S. was willing to consider other alternatives to retroactive pricing in order to get rid of the surcharges, is that correct? Mr. Anderson. Yes, Mr. Chairman. Exhibit 46 is a document that analyzes various responses from various members of the 661 Committee to the problem of surcharges. This is a matrix that was drawn up at one point during the 6 months of debate within the committee on how to deal with this problem, and it illustrates the range of ideas that were under discussion. When you add up the various positions, you can see why we were not able to reach a consensus that we felt would be effective. Mr. Whitfield. Why did the U.S. and Great Britain desire proactive pricing to be conditioned on a mandatory lifting requirement? Mr. Stupak. This document number 46, could you tell us the source of that document? Mr. Whitfield. Came from the State Department. Mr. Stupak. Does Mr. Anderson have that in front of him? Mr. Anderson. Yes, I do. Mr. Stupak. Do you recognize that as a State Department document? Mr. Anderson. I know from conversations with colleagues at our mission to the United Nations that it is a United States document. It was prepared in New York by our mission. Mr. Whitfield. Can you explain why the U.S. and Great Britain desired proactive pricing to be conditioned on mandatory lifting requirements? Mr. Anderson. Mr. Chairman, I'm not an expert by any means on the oil market, but I understand from others who were--whose reasoning was behind that decision that that method would be more effective in eliminating the surcharges. Because, as I believe we heard described in the first panel, if a company that was going to lift oil was not aware at the time they agreed to lift what the price would be, it would not be possible to make an agreement with the Iraqi side for a surcharge. And if they were able to get out of that lifting obligation, then that arrangement would no longer apply. Mr. Whitfield. Now you mention in your testimony that members of the 661 Committee did not take their international obligations seriously. Could you be more specific in terms of particular countries and examples? For example, with respect to holds placed on humanitarian contracts, can you estimate what percentage of holds were placed by the U.S. and British due to concerns over potential dual-use capabilities? Mr. Anderson. I would say the vast majority of holds placed by the U.S. and U.K--over 99 percent of those holds were placed because of concerns about potential dual uses. There were a very small number of cases where some participants in the interagency review process that took place in Washington of the oil contracts signaled a concern about the pricing of the contract as potential evidence of a kickback taking place. But in almost every case, even contracts that had a pricing concern were placed on hold officially because of concerns about dual use. Mr. Whitfield. So if--you are saying over 90 percent by U.S. and Great Britain and 10 percent or less was for holds placed by the countries only? Mr. Anderson. If I understand the question, it goes to the percentage of all holds placed by the committee and how many of those were placed by the U.S. and U.K. And my understanding is that, indeed, over 90 percent were placed by the U.S. and U.K; and, therefore, all other members--the other 13 members of the committee were only responsible for 10 percent of those holds. Mr. Whitfield. I have no further questions at this time. I recognize Mr. Stupak. Mr. Stupak. Thank you. Mr. Anderson, do you agree that there was a serious humanitarian crisis in Iraq in 1995? Mr. Anderson. I would say, sir, and all the evidence that I have seen indicates that there was, indeed. Mr. Stupak. I'm looking at page 3 of your testimony, first main paragraph there. It says, the Oil-for-Food program did succeed in its humanitarian objective of ensuring that the Iraqi people were adequately fed, thus limiting the impact of the sanctions on them. Is that correct? Mr. Anderson. Yes, I think that's correct. And I would call your attention to the precise wording. Adequately fed does not mean luxuriously fed or any situation that we would all wish, but adequate, yes. Mr. Stupak. The illegal profits or sales of this oil and commodities--let's just say oil--where Saddam Hussein received these kickbacks or money to do what he wished outside the Oil- for-Food program, it's been estimated that half of this illegal money came from sales to countries like Jordan, Syria, Turkey, is that correct? Mr. Anderson. As I understand from studies that have been done of the oil market from that period, for example, the GAO study that I think you're familiar with, that is the case, yes. Mr. Stupak. If the United States was pushing in the U.N. to make sure that the Oil-for-Food program was properly followed, as they should have, then why would the U.S. allow Saddam to receive about half of his money through these illegal sales? These sales were in violation of the sanctions against Iraq? Mr. Anderson. Yes, sir. That's correct. That's the reason that the U.S. Government under the Foreign Assistance Act certified to the Congress that assistance to Jordan every year starting in 1991 and to Turkey every year starting in 1996 was in the national interest despite their violations of U.N. Sanctions. Mr. Stupak. Doesn't that send a mixed signal to everybody else? Like the sales to Jordan and Turkey, we will say that is in violation of the sanctions, but we'll look the other way. But if anyone else comes up with anything where they receive something that would be in violation of sanctions, we are going to put a hold on it or we're going to try to enforce them in the 661 Committee? Isn't that sort of a--how do you put credibility into a program when you look the other way when it's in your political interest and then yet you admonish others for doing the same thing you are doing? Mr. Anderson. Jordan came to the 661 Committee in 1991 with a request for relief from the sanctions, alleging that the enforcement of the sanctions and a ban on oil trade with Iraq would cause severe economic hardship to Jordan. Turkey also submitted a similar request for relief. The judgment of the U.S. Government as reflected in those certifications to Congress was that indeed there was--it was in the U.S. interest to take that approach. Within the U.N. system, the Jordanian request was never granted officially, but the committee ``took note,'' was the terminology that they used, of the trade between Jordan and Iraq. And the U.S. in many bilateral diplomatic exchanges with Jordan suggested that the trade with Iraq in the other direction, in other words, the compensation that Jordan paid to Iraq, should only be in barter terms with humanitarian goods. In the case of Turkey, the 661 Committee never acknowledged the request; and the U.S. also had many diplomatic exchanges with Turkey about attempting to limit those purchases from Iraq. Mr. Stupak. As I said in my opening, it's a geopolitical decision, but I think we lose credibility when we start talking about sanctions and what other countries can do. Even though Jordan and Turkey did go to the standing committee, it sounds like the standing committee did not approve it, but yet the U.S. did as a matter of policy. We're supposed to be the big enforcer, us and the United Kingdom, to say these sanctions have to work; and if they work, we have to play by the same rules. When it was to our interest, we forget the rules, correct? Mr. Anderson. What Jordan and Turkey were doing was not a secret. It was known to the committee and made clear to the world and U.S. Congress and it is of a fundamentally different character than this list of under-the-table, secretive, manipulative means of gaining illegal revenue that the Saddam Hussein regime engaged in. Mr. Stupak. There are numerous allegations that prohibited items also went to Iraq through Jordan. What kind of controls did the Security Council have over this trade? Mr. Anderson. For a period of time, Jordan had an inspection system at its port in Aqaba of goods that were entering Iraq that was run by a private contractor. And the Jordanians assured us--and again, we had many diplomatic exchanges with them to make sure that they would police that trade to make sure that only those humanitarian goods were traded back to Iraq in exchange for the oil. Mr. Stupak. But we know that wasn't the case now, right? Mr. Anderson. Every regime has exceptions, it has violations, including in this case. Mr. Stupak. Did the U.S. relieve its inspector of those duties--that was supposed to be doing these inspections along the border there in Jordan? Did Jordan have an inspector that was supposed to be looking at these commodities to make sure they didn't violate the understanding that only certain humanitarian things could move from Jordan to Iraq? Did Jordan remove its inspector who was supposed to be head of this program and make sure that only the proper commodities went into--or humanitarian products went into Iraq. Mr. Anderson. I am not familiar with the details of that. I can get an answer back to you. [The following was received for the record:] This question should be directed to the Government of Jordan, which had responsibility for its side of the border. Mr. Stupak. If you would, please. Thanks. In June 1997, the United States and the United Kingdom told the sanctions committee that it was, ``beyond the committee's competence to approve exports of Iraqi oil,'' to Jordan. Such approval raised all sorts of questions which had been put aside over the past few years, the U.S. stated. Is this your understanding of the situation concerning illegal trade between Iraq and Jordan? Is this your understanding? Mr. Anderson. As I said earlier, the 661 Committee took note of the trade, but the 661 Committee did not authorize it. And the U.S. participated in that decision. Mr. Stupak. You know, when we opened up the pipeline, and I think it was you that said that, that it was supposed to be an experiment at first just to make sure that it worked. But that was their pipeline going up to Syria there. Mr. Anderson. Yes, sir. Mr. Stupak. After that, that pipeline never really shut down. And that's where a lot of these illegal sales took place, was through Turkey, and really outside the Oil-for-Food program. Were any attempts made by the State Department to shut that down? Mr. Anderson. Many, many attempts, both by raising this issue within the 661 Committee and also directly with Syria. Mr. Stupak. And nothing ever happened. Right? Mr. Anderson. That's correct. Mr. Stupak. Okay. Was the State Department aware of all the end use of all this oil that was being sold illegally, that the end use was here in the United States? Mr. Anderson. I believe the State Department received the same kind of statistical reports on the oil industry that are widely available to the industry. So I assume so. Yes, sir. Mr. Stupak. I asked a question earlier that has been bothering me. Maybe you can shed some light on it. I had asked of the other witness, Mr. Fawcett, because he sort of raised it in his report, that when we started in 1997, the first year of the program, the United States was the biggest user of the oil--Iraqi oil at 13 percent. By 1999, it rose to 35 percent. And since September 11, the U.S. had been purchasing well over 50 percent of all Iraqi oil sold underneath the Oil-for-Food program. And every year, it kept going up. And it's just not clear why the U.S. would purchase such large quantities of Iraqi oil under this program in the wake of September 11 and the thoughts of going to war. Can you explain that? Was there any State Department rationale why they would continue to buy that oil? Mr. Anderson. As far as I know, it wasn't a State Department decision one way or the other on whether that oil should be purchased. Those are transactions done by private companies on the oil market within the framework of U.S. Law and international law. Mr. Stupak. Yeah, but still ended up here. Wouldn't you do an investigation to try to enforce this so it did not end up on the U.S. market? And if we are trying to be true to the spirit of the sanctions, I would think you would not want Iraqi oil coming in here since we have these sanctions against them. Mr. Anderson. I think the simple answer to that is the oil market is one big pool, and at one end, oil is put in. Obviously, there are some limits on the particular qualities that are for particular purposes. But if the oil is going into that market from Iraq and the U.S. is purchasing oil, it really doesn't matter whether a specific oil from Iraq ends up in the U.S. or some other--it goes somewhere else and the U.S. substitutes; it's one big pool. Mr. Stupak. Thank you. Mr. Whitfield. The gentleman's time has expired. At this point, I will recognize Dr. Burgess for 10 minutes. Mr. Burgess. Thank you. And thank you, Mr. Anderson, for taking time to be with us here today. In your testimony, you stated that, besides the surcharges and kickbacks, the United States also brought to the 661 Committee evidence and information concerning additional violations of the program, the Oil-for-Food program. And we have got in our binder that was provided to us Exhibit 45. And I guess, just like Mr. Stupak, this is a document that is known to you. Correct? Mr. Anderson. Yes, sir. Mr. Burgess. Okay. Exhibit 45, an e-mail dated March 5, 2002, on truck briefing points. And this document describes a situation where the United States apparently learned that Iraq was diverting trucks imported under the program for military purposes. Are you familiar with this? Mr. Anderson. Yes, sir. Mr. Burgess. Was this matter addressed within the 661 Committee? Mr. Anderson. Yes, it was. Mr. Burgess. And what was their feeling about this? Mr. Anderson. This e-mail is dated 1 day before an interagency group from the U.S. Government briefed the committee on what we knew about the diversion of trucks that were brought into Iraq ostensibly for humanitarian purposes and were then diverted to military use. And this is precisely the kind of concern that was uppermost in our mind within the committee, in making sure that goods were not diverted to military use. And that's why we went to the trouble of presenting that briefing. And the result of that was a change in the judgments of the committee on what types of trucks would be considered humanitarian. Mr. Burgess. Well, clearly, the United States and the State Department were concerned. Were other members of the committee, did they express concern or surprise that this diversion was occurring? Mr. Anderson. This is, sir, a rather typical exchange. Typically, if someone presented information on a sanctions violation of this sort, it was usually either the United States or the United Kingdom. Typically, depending on the nature of the evidence, if the evidence was very clear and compelling, there wasn't too much that other committee members could say about it. If the evidence was circumstantial, as sometimes was the case when there would only be a newspaper article from the press somewhere without any corroborating evidence, other members of the committee would challenge that newspaper article and would say that no action could be taken until there was more substantial evidence. But in this particular case, the evidence was quite compelling, and there was action taken. Mr. Burgess. So the diversion of these trucks to military use, I mean, what did France think was eventually going to happen? Mr. Anderson. Well, I think the position of other countries on the committee typically was to react to the information that was presented to them. And we've heard earlier described the contract process, where contract documents would come to the committee. They would look at that and approve the contract or put the contract on hold. And then, if the--in this case, say a truck contract said that it was going to be used for a hospital or to transport food or just some civilian use, no one in the committee would challenge that, they would accept that. But then if you then subsequently showed them evidence that in fact these trucks were going right from the port to the military base being used by the Iraqi military and you have compelling evidence of that, they then react to that and say, oh, well, of course that's in violation of the sanctions, and that's not acceptable. Mr. Burgess. Well, then there's another--if we just skip ahead to Exhibit 47 and let me ask the same question. Is this an exhibit that is known to you? Is this an e-mail, internal e- mail from the State Department as well? Mr. Anderson. Yes, sir. Mr. Burgess. This one describes the diversion of Ventolin inhalers. Are you familiar with this incident? Mr. Anderson. I'm familiar with the document, and I've also had some conversations with colleagues who were involved in dealing with it. Yes, sir. Mr. Burgess. Now, did we, the United States, ever confirm whether this medicine that was found in Syria actually came from an Oil-for-Food shipment diverted from Iraq? Mr. Anderson. We have initiated--since the staff of the committee brought this particular document to our attention, our mission in New York has been searching their records to see, to get the answer to that question. As of today, they have not found any indication that we did confirm that or that any particular action was taken within the 661 Committee with regard to this. But I would say, sir, that this is an example of a fragmentary information on a possible sanctions violation. We very frequently got such fragmentary information. It would basically be a tip from a source, and we would take that information as far as we could take it, and sometimes, it would involve calling it to the attention of the U.N. Office of the Iraq program and asking that they take particular care in following such matters. In other cases, if it involved a country that was a member of the Security Council on the committee, raising--the fact of raising it in the committee would mean that it was highlighted that it was going on, and we would do that with the hope that that country would then subsequently refrain from that type of behavior. Mr. Burgess. But, of course, I mean, as you know, and we have heard in this room this afternoon the United States has taken a great deal of criticism from the United Nations and from outside the United Nations from blocking the flow of humanitarian goods into Iraq. Is it fair to conclude that the Iraqi regime may have actually been cashing in on medicines intended for its own people? And this is Ventolin; it's an inhaler used for asthmatic children. And they were taking this--it looks like they were taking this across the border, turning it into cash for some other purpose. Do you think that's a possibility? Mr. Anderson. Absolutely. Mr. Burgess. Well, given the obstacles for reform within the United Nations, why didn't the United States, as Mr. Fawcett has suggested, put public pressure on France, Russia and others to eliminate this type of abuse? I mean, again, here we have got a medicine to go to asthmatic Iraqi children we are selling in the pharmacy of Damascus for whatever purpose, who knows, and the money is coming back to the Saddam regime. Why didn't--why wasn't more pressure put on France, Russia to-- Germany to stop this? Mr. Anderson. I would say we certainly put tremendous pressure on France and Russia, and then Germany of course during the period that Germany is a member of the Security Council, but certainly on France and Russia within the framework of the council. And as far as public pressure, I think, on the general issue of dealing with Iraq, there was a tremendous amount of public pressure on France and Russia on the overall issue of dealing with Saddam Hussein. With regard to these specific violations, it would depend on the issue. I mean, different countries could be involved at different times. But certainly within the framework of the committee, it was very clear that there was a struggle under way between the U.S. and the U.K. On the one hand and the other three permanent members, Russia, France and China, on the other, on a whole range of issues. During the period before the smart sanctions that were addressed earlier when we were reviewing every single contract there was a lot of discussion about contract holds that the U.S. and the U.K. placed because of weapons of mass destruction or dual-use concerns. Many of those contracts were from--were submitted by companies in Russia and France or China. And we were under tremendous pressure from those governments to release the holds. So it was very clear that there was a lot of tension over those. Mr. Burgess. And I'm certain there was. But, golly, this looks pretty blatant. I mean, you have got a medicine that's used for asthmatic children in the country of Iraq, and you are selling it in Damascus on the black market. I mean, I fail to see why that's--you know, just like the other stuff we heard about, about the infant formula, paying 25 percent more than you know you should be paying for it. It's almost as if there was--well, I'm not going to say it. But it looks like this was a premeditated act at so many levels that I just simply can't shake that thought. Mr. Chairman, I will yield back my time. Mr. Whitfield. Thank you, Dr. Burgess. At this time, I will recognize Mrs. Blackburn for 10 minutes. Mrs. Blackburn. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. And I want to thank Mr. Anderson, and two of our other witnesses are still in the room. I want to thank them for their time today. This is something that is of tremendous interest not only to us but to our constituents. And I also want to thank the chairman and the ranking member for their work on getting everything ready for the hearing today. Mr. Anderson, let me just ask you this as a matter of background, and I think as we look at this and as our constituents, I know we have many who are watching the hearing and listening to the things that are going on here. Were you at the State Department in 1991 when Resolution 661 was passed? Mr. Anderson. I was at that time on assignment overseas, and I was not dealing directly with Iraq or the United Nations at that time. Mrs. Blackburn. Okay. And then when Resolution 986, in the mid 1990's, were you there at that point? Mr. Anderson. No. Mrs. Blackburn. You were not. Okay. And then for the record, let's just go ahead. In 1991, who was our Secretary of State and our U.N. Ambassador? Mr. Anderson. 1991, that was the late Bush period. So that would have been Mr. Baker as our Secretary of State at that time. Mrs. Blackburn. All right. Mr. Anderson. And our U.N. Ambassador, I would have to check the list. It was probably the period of Ambassador Pickering, I believe. Mrs. Blackburn. And then in the mid 1990's? Mr. Anderson. Mid 1990's, I guess it depends which year, whether it would be in the Clinton administration, or are you referring to the---- Mrs. Blackburn. That would have been? Mr. Anderson. Madam Albright was our representative, our permanent representative at the U.N. And then Mr. Holbrook. Mrs. Blackburn. All right. Okay. And so what I wanted to do was be certain that we realize who was at the State Department and who was our U.N. Ambassador during that period of time and who was in charge of overseeing, and then as I said, for clarification, I felt like it was important to notice to whether you were there or you were involved. Because I think it's important for people to realize, you know, we talk a lot about--we use a lot of acronyms and a lot of numbers in DC, and sometimes, it allows us to gloss over the importance of the Iraq steering committee. And this group that was put in place by Resolution 661 just simply by using numbers, you know, it does not speak specifically to the mission that these folks were given in looking at sanctions and looking at the oil and the commodities and the proper use of those items and of the proceeds from the sale of that oil. And I think that, many times, as we go back and we are looking hindsight, using the advantage of hindsight in looking at this, we have a tendency to say, how did the wheels come off of this? And how did it get to be so seemingly out of control? And that is hard for us to get our arms around, what appears to be just a blatant disregard for humanitarian aid and for the welfare and well-being of people, not to mention respect for the law. You have mentioned in your testimony a couple of different places on page 2 and 3 about the political debate and impeding action against violators of the program. And you mentioned earlier in your remarks, the U.K. Was generally with us. Mr. Anderson. Yes. Mrs. Blackburn. And then to Dr. Burgess' response you mentioned against the French and Germans. And how much of the pressure to turn a blind eye, if you will, to any actions against the violators, how much of that came from the French and Russian governments? Mr. Anderson. I would say, ma'am, that I would turn that image around. Mrs. Blackburn. Okay. Mr. Anderson. And I would say that the pressure from the U.S. and U.K. To look into violations was quite strong. And we got similar pressure back from countries that were most interested. Mrs. Blackburn. You got the push back from the French and the Russians. Mr. Anderson. Yes. That's correct. Mrs. Blackburn. Considerable? Mr. Anderson. Considerable pushback? In particular with regard to contracts that involved companies from those countries. Mrs. Blackburn. Okay. During this period of time, the mid 1990's, do you know if there was a relationship between Kofi Annan and Cotecna? Mr. Anderson. I don't have any familiarity with that beyond what I read in the second report of the Volcker Commission. Mrs. Blackburn. Do you know if Kojo Annan was involved in any way at that point? Are you aware of anything from there? Mr. Anderson. I would refer you to the report. That's the source of what I know. He was employed by Cotecna, and the dates of his employment and the conditions are detailed in the Volcker Commission's report. Mrs. Blackburn. You also mentioned in your testimony that there were regular briefings on the program that were given to the Security Council Ambassadors. Mr. Anderson. Yes. Mrs. Blackburn. And what feedback did they give and how receptive did they seem to be to negative information? Mr. Anderson. The--if I understand, ma'am, you are referring to briefings by the United States on knowledge that we had. Mrs. Blackburn. Right. Mr. Anderson. And I would say the reaction was typically negative from members of the Council, other than the U.K. It was typically--pushback was a good word, challenging the veracity of our information, challenging whether or not there was evidence to support the assertions that we were making. There was a tendency to question the information the U.S. was presenting. Mrs. Blackburn. Did they give you as much resistance on accepting negative information as they did to any type of action against the violators of the program? Mr. Anderson. I just want to see if I understand the question, ma'am. The violators, are you referring to companies or---- Mrs. Blackburn. Correct. You know, as we have talked about the violators on the aid, and you mentioned in your testimony some of the disagreements that were there, the fundamental disagreement over dealing with some of these folks. My--and what I'm trying to get to, Mr. Anderson, is how strongly they would resist, the negative information, and then turn around and deal--how strongly they would resist dealing with anybody who was trying to impede what they saw as a benefit to the French and Russian governments. Mr. Anderson. Well, I think in general everybody on the 661 Committee accepted that violations of the sanctions regime should not occur, in principle. But when it came down to specific cases of violators, there tended to be a lot of debate about the evidence, whether an actual violation had occurred and whether one could be sure, based on the available evidence, that it had occurred. Mrs. Blackburn. Okay. You know, in the last panel, one of the questions that I asked was if members of this committee, the 661 Committee, the Iraq steering committee, whatever we are going to call it, if they should come in and testify before this committee, if we should have them there. And I would be interested to hear from you if the State Department, what the State Department's opinion would be on having those members come in. Because I find it very interesting that it seems as if there was a denial, an awareness of what was probably happening, but then a choice to possibly not take action. So I would be interested in what the State Department's opinion is on that. Mr. Anderson. Well, the members of the 661 Committee of course were the 15 countries who were members of the Security Council. And the individuals who were sitting in that committee were all diplomats just as I am. So if I served--you asked, ma'am, where I was in 1991. I was in Poland, for example, and I dealt with the parliament of Poland. And occasionally they requested that a U.S. diplomat would come and talk to them in a committee setting like this. And our response to that was always that we are always happy to talk to a committee, but we are not happy to be subpoenaed by a committee because we have diplomatic immunity. And I would guess that most diplomats from the 15 countries who were on the 661 Committee, on the Iraq sanctions committee, would probably react in a similar way; that you might get people to talk to you, but I'm not sure that you would get them to testify under oath. Mrs. Blackburn. You are probably correct. And I thank you so much for your answers. Mr. Chairman, I will yield back. Mr. Whitfield. Thank you. I will recognize the gentleman from Florida for 10 minutes. Mr. Stearns. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I don't have a full length of questions here, but I just wanted to ask Mr. Anderson: Has your career pretty much been at the State Department? Mr. Anderson. Yes, sir. Mr. Stearns. From when you got out of school, college? Mr. Anderson. I was in West Africa as a Peace Corps volunteer for 2 years after college. And then I came back to Washington, and I completed my graduate studies before I joined the Foreign Service and also worked at the Commerce Department for a period of time during those graduate studies. Mr. Stearns. So you have been at the State Department how many years, would you say? Mr. Anderson. 25 years. Mr. Stearns. In your 25 years of being there, have you seen anything like this occur? Generally, you find these type of arrangements, that Saddam Hussein used oil allocations to undermine the sanctions. It's not brand-new. In your experience, have you seen other cases where this paradigm, this model has occurred in all of your experience? Is this unique in all of your professional history? Mr. Anderson. Well, sir, I would say this particular program, the structure of the program, the breadth of it, is certainly unique. But since you referred to my career, I will permit myself to refer to my experience in the Middle East. I served 5 years altogether in the Palestinian areas and in Israel. And I must say that, in the kind of approach to dealing with the rule of law that we observed in this procedure was--is something that one can see in other areas in the Middle East also. Not on this scale, but the idea that business transactions are not transparent, that there may be double- dealing or triple-dealing is certainly not unknown in that region of the world. Mr. Stearns. That is what I am trying to get at. It seems to me we have oil here, but you could have food. You could have housing. You could have health. I mean, you could have a whole series of commodities that could be used like oil. And in the Middle East, there is a climate of quid pro quo, whether it's money or other things. So what I'm trying to establish, in your professional opinion, is this unique and egregious and something that people couldn't say, Well, this is just how the Middle East is and this is how everybody does it there. So this program is no different than they have done for eons. And so for Mr. Volcker to come here and try and do a report, he might have a difficult time because he can't separate what is the custom and culture. And so I need to hear from your professional experience whether we are talking about something here that is totally separate from the argument, that's part of the culture. Mr. Anderson. I would respond, sir, that this program is different from what is typically the case in the Middle East in several aspects. One, the size, because, we were talking about---- Mr. Stearns. Billions of dollars. Mr. Anderson. Billions of dollars and comprehensive sanctions on an entire national economy. Mr. Stearns. Over a long period of time. Mr. Anderson. Over a long period of time. There's nothing on that scale. Mr. Stearns. So the scale of it, with the amount of money. And, two---- Mr. Anderson. Complexity. Mr. Stearns. Complexity. And, three, that it is over a long period of time. It wasn't just a one-time transaction. Mr. Anderson. That's correct. Mr. Stearns. Do you have--now, just I'm asking in your professional opinion here. And you can also give me a personal opinion. Do you think Volcker is going to be successful in trying to get to all the nooks and crannies here and get to the bottom of this, considering the extensive amount of relationships between nations and third parties? How do you get to the bottom of this? And do you feel confident that you can? What is your professional opinion? Mr. Anderson. Sir, I would refer you to the mandate for Volcker's committee. We were quite careful in approving the U.N. Resolution that accepted the creation of the committee to make sure that the mandate of the committee was limited. And, indeed, if you look at it, it is limited to investigating wrongdoing by U.N. Officials in violations of the rules that were established by the sanctions committee. And that means that other bad things that happened that were outside the functioning of that--the Oil-for-Food program and the procedures are certainly bad, but they may not be within the mandate of the Volcker committee. So when you ask me, do I think whether he will succeed, in answering that, I try to look at what it is, what the task that he was assigned to. Mr. Stearns. The question is, can he succeed on the task given to him? Mr. Anderson. I think it is always a question in any investigation on whether he can get evidence for any assertions. I think that he is--if you look at his first two reports, I think you will see that he has uncovered a range of assertions. Some of them have been better documented; others have been less well documented. But he has included in his report even things that are less well documented, and he might presumably be continuing to investigate as that investigation proceeds. So I would say, since the Volcker committee is not a judicial institution, it's an investigative committee, and the results of that committee's work could be and may be forwarded to national authorities in the appropriate countries. Mr. Stearns. Where would that go, to the international court? Mr. Anderson. No. I don't think so. I think it would go to national judicial authorities in appropriate countries for prosecution if---- Mr. Stearns. Because, see, when you do an investigative report, you really don't have this subpoena under oath, and you are just asking questions and people can say what they want. And so my concern is the range of answers and range of interpretations, and this whole thing gets so murky. And it seems to me we need more of a judicial investigation where you have subpoena powers that he can put them under oath and there is a case where we could, if they suborned perjury, that we could actually put them in jail, even minor people. But I just don't have the feeling that he has that kind of authority. Is that true? Mr. Anderson. That's correct. He does not have that authority. Mr. Stearns. So how can you investigate if you don't have the authority to extirpate the truth? Mr. Anderson. Well, I think what Mr. Volcker stated is that he is preparing the best information that he can based on the access he has, granted by the United Nations, and that this information will be made available to member states including the United States and our judicial authorities who do have subpoena power and investigatory authority, who can investigate, if they deem it appropriate, any of the cases that might be described in the report of the Volcker committee. Mr. Stearns. Just as an outside observer, we see that the implication of some high Russian officials that has been in the paper this week. Now, how much confidence--and I am just rhetorically putting this question out--do we think Russia is going to institute judicial prosecution against these high Russian political officials? Mr. Anderson. That's obviously up to Russia to decide. And I won't comment---- Mr. Stearns. But by opening up that, they open up a can of worms for their own policy positions at their government at the highest level. Mr. Whitfield. If I could interrupt. They informed us that they are not going to do anything. Mr. Stearns. So we've already heard from Russia that, even if their highest officials are implicated, they are not going to do anything. So, you know, it's a little frustrating I think for us to look at the Volcker Commission and think that we are going to get some solid answers, and, more importantly, there are going to be results from it. So, Mr. Chairman, with that, I just appreciate your having the hearing and want to encourage this continued investigation. But I think Mr. Anderson pointed out some problems with the ultimate jurisdiction of Volcker and getting the member country to prosecute the individuals that are guilty. Mr. Whitfield. Thank you, Mr. Stearns. At this time, I will recognize Mr. Inslee for 10 minutes. Mr. Inslee. Thank you. Mr. Anderson, I do have a question, but I need to say something before I start. So if you can just bear with me for a couple minutes. Yesterday, in preparation for the Democratic-Republican baseball game, I pressed into service a young man who is a neighbor of ours to play catch. And this young fellow, I haven't seen for a couple of years, he's been in the Army and he is scheduled for deployment in Iraq here probably early next year I think. And the reason I mention that is that, with all due respect to this hearing, I really would rather be investigating how we can make sure that young man has the tools available to keep him safe and how we can make sure that our taxpayer money is not being wasted on contracts that have been squandered, and how we can make sure that $80 million gets accounted for so that we can put that into armored HMMVWs instead of some rat's nest of profiteering in Iraq. And I've been very disturbed that our institution, the U.S. House of Representatives, is not getting to the bottom of why contractors are disposing of millions of dollars of taxpayers' money instead of having armored HMMVWs for our soldiers like my neighbor who is going there early next year. I really think that is a fitting subject of inquiry that I would hope that our committee at some time can get to. We have made numerous attempts on the floor of the House to do that. We need a Truman commission in this regard, which, frankly, is a lot more important than this subject. I would also like to see an investigation of some of the things coming out now about why my neighbor has to go to war and how that takes place--how that took place. I read a note from a London paper the other day from a July 23, 2002, memorandum that said, ``In high-level meetings between the Bush administration and the British saying military action is now inevitable, Bush wanted to remove Saddam through military action justified by the conjunction of terrorism and WMDs, but the intelligence and facts were being fixed around the policy. The case was thin. Saddam was not threatening his neighbors, and his WMD capability was less than that of Libya, North Korea or Iran.'' This is a smoking gun about what happened, why my neighbor has to go to Iraq and be subject to hostility when a war started based on false, fraudulent information. And that's what I would like to see the U.S. Congress investigating so that my neighbor doesn't get in harm's way in Iraq. Instead, we are fooling around with the history of some oil effort that, frankly, I don't think is going to keep him safe. And I hope at some point the U.S. House of Representatives does its duty, which is to have a Truman commission to investigate the fraudulent use of taxpayer money and how this war started based on false information. That's an investigation worthy of this Congress. But I want to ask you a question about this regard now, turning to the subject of this hearing. I was looking at some of the language, earlier witnesses have talked about, on kickbacks. And they submitted a document that said that while, ``While the practice has usually been associated with weapons procurement, it was also a regular feature of the Reagan administration's agricultural support program to Iraq as administered by the U.S. Department of Agriculture's commodity credit corporation.'' In this guise, it was known as, ``after- sales service.'' Do you know how that happened and what was going on there? Mr. Anderson. I believe that program was administered by the Agriculture Department, and I would have to get you an answer from them or refer you to them. I'm not familiar with that. This question should be directed to the Department of Agriculture, which administered that program. Mr. Inslee. Thank you. I'll appreciate it if you can do that. Now, you're in the office--you're the director of the Office of Peacekeeping Sanctions and Counterterrorism. That's your current title? Mr. Anderson. Yes, sir. Mr. Inslee. And what were you doing back in July 2002? Mr. Anderson. July 2002, I was the counselor to the U.S. embassy in Warsaw, Poland. Mr. Inslee. Okay. So could you give us any information about this British memorandum that suggests that the Bush administration had made a decision to take military action in July 2002 based on flimsy evidence, on thin evidence based on assertions that WMD had less capability in Iraq that Libya, North Korea or Iran? Do you know anything about that? Mr. Anderson. No, I don't. Mr. Inslee. I wish you did, because that's the thing I would like to see the U.S. Congress finally figure out, how this war started based on false information. Thank you. Mr. Whitfield. I will recognize the gentleman from Michigan for a brief remark. Mr. Stupak. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. And I just want--you know, today's hearing got off a little bit there on the wrong foot with some documents coming into the--or wanted to be admitted into the record. And, you know, we have always worked well on this committee in a bipartisan manner; I hope we can keep that up. In my opening statement I indicated to you that I thought that we should do further investigation along these lines, especially some of the U.S. interests in some of the U.S. oil companies that may or may not have benefited from this Oil-for-Food program. So I would hope in the weeks ahead that we can take another look at that. We have a couple subpoena requests that we had asked and documents we wanted from certain documents; hopefully, the majority would honor that and sign the subpoenas so we can get the documents front and center. I think what the committee has done today is sort of tip of the iceberg, but you can sort of see the frustration on this. We all have strong feelings on this, even the last questioner there, my friend from Washington, there, mentioned the impact of this. It's more than just Food-for-Oil program; it's the whole Iraq war and everything else, which sort of gets energy levels up around here. And no disrespect meant to the Chair or anything like that, but we do have some strong feelings on this side as I'm sure you do on your side, and we'd like to use this committee as being as bipartisan as we are and that, that we continue to work on this issue, but hopefully, we can have a full investigation including the areas that the minority would like to explore through subpoena or interviews of companies. And we would hope you would join with us in that request. Mr. Whitfield. Thank you, Mr. Stupak. And, Mr. Anderson, thank you for your testimony today. As we all know, the chairman of the full committee has a real interest in this whole subject matter, and I know that there will be additional discussions as we move forward in trying to make some determinations about which ways to go in further hearings on this subject. So, with that, this hearing is adjourned. And I appreciate your testimony. [Whereupon, at 5:42 p.m., the subcommittee was adjourned.] [Additional material submitted for the record follows:] <GRAPHIC OMMITTED> See the end of the file for all omitted graphics <GRAPHIC OMMITTED> See the end of the file for all omitted graphics <GRAPHIC OMMITTED> See the end of the file for all omitted graphics <GRAPHIC OMMITTED> See the end of the file for all omitted graphics <GRAPHIC OMMITTED> See the end of the file for all omitted graphics <GRAPHIC OMMITTED> See the end of the file for all omitted graphics <GRAPHIC OMMITTED> See the end of the file for all omitted graphics <GRAPHIC OMMITTED> See the end of the file for all omitted graphics <GRAPHIC OMMITTED> See the end of the file for all omitted graphics <GRAPHIC OMMITTED> See the end of the file for all omitted graphics <GRAPHIC OMMITTED> See the end of the file for all omitted graphics <GRAPHIC OMMITTED> See the end of the file for all omitted graphics <GRAPHIC OMMITTED> See the end of the file for all omitted graphics 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